Portals and pure OpenGL

Discussion in 'Development & Distribution' started by princec, Jun 20, 2005.

  1. patrox

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    quiz:
    1)they need free games to offer for their new "get a free game" trial.
    2)it's hard to find decent content.
    3)they need diversity
    4)they need new things to keep customers to log back in and click on the ads. ( so even a game that doesn't sell generates revenues )
    5)bandwidth is cheap ( they probably have unmetered servers anyway )
    6)puppygames rules

    pat.
     
  2. Bmc

    Bmc New Member

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    1) the free game offer is actually a free month to gamepass, which entitles the customer to one free game every month. the customer picks whatever game they want from the current selection real offers. they don't have or need special games to give away for free. In most case these special free games would be shit (like the free one Big Fish Offers). Games that just don't sell so I assume they pay a low price to use them to help increase their site's stickiness.
    2) How does that apply to a game that sells only a few thousand copies compared to one that sells tens of thousands of copies. Surely the better selling title has more quality.

    The rest of your points don't really have any meaning on the argument. Sure bandwith is cheap, puppygame rules etc... but they can only add so many games a week without oversaturating, why would they choose a game they know is going to sell only a thousand copies over one that will do much more.

    For Cas:
    Maybe look into getting someone experienced with DirectX to port your OpenGl code over. Your gfx code should be decoupled from everything else so it shouldn't be too big of a problem..
     
  3. Sillysoft

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    You have the game. I say just send it to them and see if they take it. If nobody wants it as-is then you could think about other options. Cross that bridge if you come to it.
     
  4. Bad Sector

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    You indeed was doing something wrong. OpenGL 1.1 is way too simple and well tested. Graphical glitches could happen by bad drivers - but not complete absence of textures, especially for a so recent graphics card. The fact that other people's engine were having the same problem means nothing - they could be using wrong patterns too (f.e. many people learn OpenGL by reading NeHe code - ask any person who really knows about OpenGL and graphics programming and he'll tell you that NeHe tutorials have enough bugs to not be that good).

    Here is a personal experience. I was writing that OpenGL code. It was working ok with my computer. It was working ok with my second computer and it even worked ok with my father's Voodoo 3500tv-based computer with some weird drivers i found over the net.

    But it was NOT working in a friend's computer. After a lot of frustation i decided to do write something like:

    Code:
    frame++;
    while ((error = glGetError()) != GL_NO_ERROR)
            recordError(frame, error);
    
    at the end of my main loop, after calling the render() function. Guess what... OpenGL was indeed reporting errors - in all of the test machines. It's just that my machines was working around it, while my friend's was not :).

    The moral is: don't blame OpenGL. It's a well-established, proven API. It is very well designed and supported almost everywhere (well, the only OS i can think that doesn't support a basic OpenGL 1.1 implementation is DOS - and even that can be argued because of Mesa's software implementation). Blame the coder. 99% of the cases is coder's fault :).

    ...and don't be so sure about this 1%... ;-)
     
  5. luggage

    Moderator Original Member Indie Author

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    Cas - do you have any figures on how many of the people who don't have GL drivers actually go and get them? Do you log the fact that they didn't have them and then if they play it again later and it works do you keep track? You could work out a (very) rough idea on how many people just think "bugger it" and go away to play something else that will work.

    --Edit--
    Oh. And I agree with SillySoft. You have it now so submit and suck it and see.
     
    #25 luggage, Jun 20, 2005
    Last edited: Jun 20, 2005
  6. princec

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    I just know ;)

    Cas :)
     
  7. Bmc

    Bmc New Member

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    This is really good advice. See if the portals take it. If they do wait and see the reaction. If you need to port it to make more sales do it then.
     
  8. soniCron

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    And if they drop it before development is over?
     
  9. princec

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    Yes and yes. Let's just say that about 1% of those without drivers will bother to get the game to work by downloading new ones, and of those 1%, 0% will buy the game anyway. There seems to be a strong correlation between people buying the games I write and people who already have drivers...

    Real don't want Ultratron that's for sure. Apparently keys are the death of it though. That's to be expected though, I wasn't aiming Ultratron at the casual games crowd. But it wasn't rejected for OpenGL reasons...

    Cas :)
     
  10. princec

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    Dead right, and probably the main reason I don't want to go switching to something completely new. I've spent over 3 years making my graphics code work flawlessly. Yet at least half the games I have tried from indies here on this very forum don't work properly on most of the machines I have access to.

    I'll give you a tip here but the OpenGL ones always work flawlessly; it's the DX ones that fail...

    Cas :)
     
  11. Savant

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    From a practical standpoint, "I've invested years in this" isn't a valid reason for hanging onto something. If OpenGL is a problem (and we know it is) and Java is a problem (and, again, we know it is), logic would dictate that maybe it's time to try something else.
     
  12. ggambett

    Moderator Original Member Indie Author

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    Another way of seeing it is that just by changing the underlying technology, your potential market increases by 50%. Without changing the game in the least bit, which I know it's important for you, and I respect that. I'd do it without hesitation.
     
  13. luggage

    Moderator Original Member Indie Author

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    That's quite interesting. 1% sucks. I guess it shows just how fickle our audience actually is.

    Have you thought about just putting a cross hair controlled by the mouse that people can just point and shoot with? Have your character in the middle of the screen and it doesn't move. Not the same game I know but you still get the satisfaction when you shoot something and it'd be a cinch to play. For half hours work it may be worth a try.
     
  14. princec

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    You're jumping the gun a bit there. There are no problems with either of them in my games. See? My games work. I've taken 3 years to figure out how to do it so reliably it puts many retail games to shame.

    Cas :)
     
  15. Bmc

    Bmc New Member

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    then you obviously wouldn't port it. it would have to be doing pretty bad for them to drop it... obviously you wouldn't waste anymore time developing a dud.
     
  16. Savant

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    Maybe I'm misremembering then, but from what I recall every time you post a new game it's followed by a series of posts from people who can't launch the JVM and whatever else goes wrong. Now, maybe that's becoming less of an issue these days because the people here have Puppified their machines to run your games - if that's the case, that's even more dangerous from a testing standpoint.

    If you're happy, that's great, but historically the API and language you've chosen have caused countless problems.
     
  17. princec

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    The problem is it'd take me another 3 years to get it to the same level it's at now at the rate I can afford to do it. So: I've got all this stuff, and it works. I also would like to point out it runs unmodified on the Mac which is something of an advantage. If it fails on one platform it invariably fails in the same way on another platform which is nice.

    Cas :)
     
  18. princec

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    No, really, you're just making this up. It's suffered counted problems, and each was easy to solve, once and for all. They're all gone. There may be the odd issue with Webstart but I don't use Webstart for deployment generally, just during testing.

    Cas :)
     
  19. Savant

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    *shrug* OK, best of luck then! I hope you're right.
     
  20. soniCron

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    I don't know anyone is suggesting your games are at fault. "I built a car that runs on gasoline more efficiently than anything! What? Nobody sells gasoline anymore? Screw it, I developed it, I'm selling it!"
     

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