Pirate Software

Discussion in 'Game Development (Technical)' started by voodooshaman, Jun 6, 2006.

  1. vjvj

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    I've been using purchased, licensed software since I was 19 years old with a crappy Taco Bell job.

    Now, 12 years later, there are so many free/cheap alternatives out there I don't understand why anyone would really need to warez anything. The only time in recent memory that I had to spend more than ~$30 US was when I bought XSI... And at $500, that was quite a deal.

    There is also a long assed thread here:

    http://forums.indiegamer.com/showthread.php?t=6708

    ultimately leading to here:

    http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.aspx?catid=33&threadid=1837696&enterthread=y

    With a gigantic list of cheap/free stuff. So if you're wondering how we get by with no budget, you should find plenty of clues there.
     
  2. Teq

    Teq
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    There really is no need for pirating these days, I'd feel guilty about doing so, after all, we all know what its like to have someone download your software and not pay for it (or you have developed software for them only to ditch it when you are near completion...grrr). These are the free/shareware alternatives I use:

    Eclipse (+mingw +gcc)
    GIMP
    Milkshape (a steal at 21GBP)
    Sound Recorder (lol, really, but I plug in my guitar, synth and amp, plus I use a shareware ogg encoding/recording app as well but I can't for the life of me remember its name)
    OpenOffice
    XVI32 (free hex editor)
    Context (text editor with pretty colours)
    Firefox
    Thunderbird
     
  3. oNyx

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    Heh. Context looks pretty neat. It has pretty much all features I need... but it lacks utf8 support, which is essential for me.
     
  4. GBGames

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    Well, won't it say what its name is when you run it?
     
  5. Laser Lou

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    BTW, this appeared on XSIBase today: http://shaders.moederogall.com/BHairy/index.html
     
  6. Applewood

    Moderator Original Member Indie Author

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    Couple of points.

    1) I think the poster is just a bored board troll looking to stoke the fires. No-one could be that stupid.

    2) Someone, can't remember who, can't be arsed to scroll down, said "When I can afford it, I'll pay for it." I'm still lmao over that one. Maybe if he tries real hard he can make himself believe it.

    3) Stop using shit tools just because they're cheap or free. The most valuable commodity you have is time, and how much of that are you prepared to piss away to save a few hundred bucks by working around crap tools instead of using good ones ? It's a false economy any way you look at it. If you've not got the money upfront, you should've thought out your business plan a bit better.

    4) I for one think 3DS Max 8 is a bargain price if you need its features - it's a month or two of one programmers salary. However, 7 comes without the 8 stuff you'll never want and is much cheaper - about 2K if you shop around. That's peanuts!
     
  7. GBGames

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    On the other hand, when you can use your budget to pay for code, art, music, or sound effects made by someone else, you free up time to learn the tools you ARE going to use. I don't think it is a bad business plan to start now rather than wait until you can afford everything.

    Also, some cheap or free tools are amazing. Subversion is a great time saver, for instance.
     
  8. Savant

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    Realize that most people here aren't running companies. They're working on games in their home offices (at best) and haven't shipped anything yet. For those people, 2K is a HELL of a lot of money.
     
  9. JasonD

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    For asking questions?

    This thread has been a positive thing. I commend the people who recognize the importance of freedom of speech.

    I totally agree that time is the most valuable commodity. You have to think about what you are giving up in the long run due to the lack of a short term sacrifice. Do not assume it is better because it is free. Look at the hidden costs, and see what you are really paying for it. Then, make a decision on which tool to 'buy'.

    Any advice that requires going back in time is not very helpful, I'm afraid.
     
  10. vjvj

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    Wait, who's the troll? ;)

    I doubt many of us use "shit" tools. Fanatics aside, most of us just try to find the best bang/buck and go with that. I've not yet found a reason to regret buying XSI over Max 8. However, the decision to buy XSI came after evaluating Milkshape, Character FX, etc. first. (I'll probably still use Wings, though :))
     
  11. Applewood

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    They might claim that, but if you're doing it for profit then you are very much running a company and need to manage all the usual stuff like cashflow and investment, even if you're not registered at companies house yet. People doing games for a hobby are in even worse shape advocating piracy - they have the choice to either pay for their hobby tools from their real job or find a cheaper hobby, same as goes for anglers, philatelists, astronomers, etc.

    The point I was trying to get across is that if your game needs a shitload of complex 3D in it, you need something like Max. If you can't afford Max, you can't afford the art content either, therefore this is moot. What you don't want to do is waste 5K worth of your time trying to save 3K by using blender instead. (For example, never used blender and it may be great, but you get what I'm trying to say.)

    And yes, some cheap tools are indeed great. About the 4th thing installed on any new pc of mine is pro-motion which seldom gets a mention but is the best pixel art tool on the planet imo. The argument here is more about putting up with crap *because* its cheap.

    It wasn't really meant as advice. I was more trying to emphasize that you shouldn't just dive into anything without preparation. I have no sympathy for those that do in any walk of life, but especially when it's actually your livelihood we're talking about.

    Heh, I think I can see the sarcasm here. I was of course referring to the guy telling a bunch of programmers that he's pirated every program under the sun. But yes, I've been quiet for a while myself. I dissappeared when the site seemed to be turned over to 95% breakout clone feedback requests and I was moaned at for telling a skr1ptk1ddy idiot he was an idiot.

    I know what you're trying to say here. However citing free speech when you confess a murder to the police is still going to get you arrested and rightly so.
     
  12. Aldacron

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    That has nothing to do with any moderated forums. If that were true then moderation of any kind would be unconstitutional. When you allow other people to join a message board, online game, or other such community it is a necessity to be able to apply some control over what is discussed. If the moderators here determined that piracy is a taboo topic, they have every right to shut down threads that discuss it. That would not be a violation of anyone's freedom of speech as forum members would be free to discuss piracy outside of these forums.
     
  13. vjvj

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    Yeah, just messin' with ya :)

    Great post, and I agree.
     
  14. JasonD

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    When I referred to 'freedom of speech', I meant the freedom to speak about related topics. If this piracy thread were shut down, it would be shutting off the discussion of issues that directly relate to software development. Perhaps 'censorship' is a better word.
     
  15. voodooshaman

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    With statements like this, you're the biggest troll here. This is flame-bait.

    Oh for God's sake, now who's been stupid? There's a whole word of difference between commiting a murder and commiting copyright theft. For one thing; they're two completely different types of law: one is criminal, the other civil. If I went to a cop shop today and 'confessed', they'd tell me to f**k off and stop wasting their time.

    Stealing a book from a bookshop and downloading a copy are not the same acts under law. A lot of people wouldn't dream of doing the former, yet they wouldn't think twice about doing the latter. Perhaps the law needs to catch up before people's attitudes change.
     
  16. Applewood

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    I have nothing to say in reply.
     
  17. Desktop Gaming

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    I played Monkey Island once... it had pirates in.
     
  18. voodooshaman

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    I had a pirate copy of Monkey Island. :D
     
  19. cliffski

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    I bought my copy.
     
  20. GBGames

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    I may be misunderstanding what you're saying, but the reason why they are two different things is that one is theft and the other is copyright infringement. When you steal a product, the store has one less item to sell. When you download a product, the store does not lose the ability to sell that product to someone who would be willing to pay for it. It has nothing to do with what people will likely think to do in either case.

    It is why it ruffles more than a few feathers when someone calls copyright infringement "theft". It's misrepresenting what actually happened. If someone actually stole your game, that would mean that they somehow tricked you out of the exclusive rights to it. I don't know of any cases of actual theft, although works in the public domain have been "stolen". "It's a Wonderful Life" is a good example of a once-public domain work that gained most of its value in the public domain. Then a court ruled that because it is based off of a work that was still protected under copyright, it also gets to be protected.
     

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