Moonface bounce - feedback reques

Discussion in 'Feedback Requests' started by jankoM, Nov 30, 2008.

  1. jankoM

    Indie Author

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    Hi,

    This is a flash game we are making. I rather ask for feedback while game is still in the work in progress stage so I can try to incorporate what your tell me.

    You can play the current version here: http://itmmetelko.com/storage_sarah/

    Levels, texts, panels, various, fonts, panels, instructions, smaller bugs are still to be fixed.

    The game starts as if you already solved 6 levels (so you can choose from them) for testing purposes. Otherwise levels get enabled when you solve previous one with small enough number of lines.

    Levels and numbers of lines to pass are not yet final, only 12 levels that will all get refined are currently made.

    I made an early version of this game a year back. It was more a toy than a game (no limitations, no YOU WIN, no disabled levels) and people didn't like it at all. This time I am trying to make it into more proper game and we will see what happens.

    Maybe interesting, you can export and import solutions (the small e and i buttons on bottom right. (use mouse right click menu to "paste" / "select all" "copy") .

    Sounds are being made and are not yet in... The REPLAY button should be renamed to PLAY AGAIN as a kind person already reminded me :)

    How to play:
    You draw lines so that the moon bounces of them and picks up all the stars after you press the Play button.
    Lines can be of 3 colours. Green line bounces with 0.7 factor , orange with 1, and violet with 1.5 .
    You must not touch the black lines. If you pick up all the stars with less lines than limit is the next level becomes enabled.

    Solutions import/export
    You can try to import 2 solutions that I just made right now if you are too lazy to make your own :)

    {level}{ball x='469' y='97' /} {star x='471' y='253' /} {star x='328' y='254' /} {star x='192' y='253' /} {star x='71' y='254' /} {line bounce='0' x1='272' y1='194' x2='272.64883605773' y2='278.997523562573' /} {line bounce='0' x1='401' y1='194' x2='399.650963586729' y2='278.989294036106' /} {line bounce='0' x1='132' y1='200' x2='132.708308739707' y2='284.99704876482' /} {line bounce='1' x1='510' y1='281' x2='453.78991376588' y2='344.760694832733' /} {line bounce='1' x1='310' y1='366' x2='225.08022653982' y2='362.307835936514' /} {line bounce='1' x1='137' y1='238' x2='154.37262301866' y2='321.205720773583' /} {line bounce='1' x1='237' y1='266' x2='263.879360111431' y2='185.361919665706' /} {line bounce='1' x1='8' y1='169' x2='5.52532130204188' y2='253.963968629896' /} {line bounce='1' x1='76' y1='353' x2='153.814381237245' y2='387.204123620767' /} {line bounce='1' x1='318' y1='322' x2='370' y2='277' /} {/level}

    and

    {level}{ball x='66' y='111' /} {star x='174' y='113' /} {star x='373' y='111' /} {star x='175' y='265' /} {star x='387' y='267' /} {line bounce='0' x1='158' y1='177' x2='242.992955249708' y2='175.905670104081' /} {line bounce='1' x1='37' y1='263' x2='100.569184094984' y2='319.426579140491' /} {line bounce='1' x1='288' y1='341' x2='371' y2='326' /} {line bounce='1' x1='271' y1='326' x2='356' y2='326' /} {line bounce='1' x1='445' y1='305' x2='498.781488425665' y2='239.177879837246' /} {line bounce='1.5' x1='164' y1='165' x2='235' y2='167' /} {/level}

    So far they ran absolutely the same on every computer I tried it on. If those two solutions don't pick up all stars on your computer please let me know!

    A mandatory screenshot:
    [​IMG]
     
    #1 jankoM, Nov 30, 2008
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2008
  2. Maupin

    Original Member

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    I just gave it a quick try. I imported the first text, but clicking the green arrow started a line and then I was stuck with an extra line and no way to delete it. I then beat the level (using the imported lines + one other that I drew trying to get out of drawing a line) with "0 lines" and moved on to the next level, but the lines I was stuck drawing were still there. And then when I returned to the menu they were still in the background behind the start button, with one in the process of being drawn, stretching from the first point to my mouse pointer.
     
  3. jankoM

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    Hi Maupin :) ... Thats why I wrote *use mouse right click menu to "paste"* .. that is one bug that I knew of, BUT IS FIXED NOW so you can use Ctrl+V or whatever hopefully. Please try again.
     
  4. Maupin

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    Ah, okay. ;) Works now.

    Is there a reason for the moon fading out? Or the different colored lines? I expected one to bounce the moon further or something but I couldn't tell a difference.

    Edit: It would be great to be able to erase lines (selectively, not all at once). Also, the white (pen?) icon doesn't seem to do anything.

    Also, a few times the moon seemed to pass through the tips of lines I drew. Usually it was on the edge but should have hit. I know when I was doing time independent circle - line collision for a past project, I had to account for the endpoints of the lines, too. Just calculating the intersection between the centerpoint of the circle's path line and the line segment would cause misses similar to what I saw here.
     
    #4 Maupin, Nov 30, 2008
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2008
  5. jankoM

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    Yes, I should of really mention it, since there is no help screen yet.

    The lines that you get to draw: Green line bounces with 0.7 factor , orange with 1, and violet with 1.5.

    You should not touch the black lines because they "kill" you. They are the obstacle. (I will update the first post)
     
  6. Cevo70

    Cevo70 New Member

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    I had fun for awhile with this one. Suggestions:

    1. Graphically, instead of plain (crayon style) lines, what if the lines were moon/star/sky themed like the rest of the game? Could you draw clouds, or a sort of sparkle/dust, or rays of light?

    2. I found myself not wanting to bother with the different lines. Not sure why exactly, but I felt that each level took some toying around anyhow, and it was more a matter of angles and placement than which lines I used. Maybe you can simplify by only having one kind of line, and then also adding another type of item/tool to use?

    3. Is there a button that allows us to erase the last move or line drawn? Maybe that would make it too easy, but it was tough to finally get a line right, and then have to redraw from the beginning, because it was impossible to redraw that first good line exactly as I had it. (this might have been mine own lazy fault)

    Cool concept, simple to understand.

    Hope this helps.
     
  7. jankoM

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    Hm.. yes I think you are right.. I will try few things and see if I can come up with something that looks and works ok.

    Yes, I know this feeling as I had it also. And I also always try to minimize/unify. I had more different lines before, but I minimized to 3 now. One that bounces you back more, one the same, and one less. Many levels could be solved with only middle line, and other too seem like a noise in that case but there are levels there now (and will be even more at later levels) which will need for example the violet (1.5 bounce) becasue for example the ball is low and must slowly bounce up and up to some height to pick stars. For the 0.7 factor line I intend to make some levels when you solve them by letting ball roll between two borders or something on the green line. So at the end I think they enable me to do more interesting levels, but I agree that they are unnecesary at big part of levels.

    I fear that people will hate the game for not having an erase button, but that is the limiting factor that makes level solution challenginh. "you must use X or less lines to progress to next level". If you could delete lines you could draw them and delete them until you get the perfect position and angle and this whole challenge is lost.

    I had a game without any limitations as a first version, you could play any level at any time, and you vere the only judge of how well you solved a level + I didn't want a result to be quantified but that quality/ how in a fun interesting way you solve the level... well you could export it and brag compare to others :).. BUT that was the theory, but nobody liked it :)

    Thanks Cevo70 for your feedback!

    About erasing, I already explained my thoughts one paragraph up. The white icon is mean only as a indicator when you can draw and when not.. and to possibly hint you that you select colors there. Hm.. I will think about it, I see now that you say .. that it can confuse the player.. but I don't have any good idea how to message to the gameplayer "this is not to click on thing"

    Yes, the math it calculates and reacts to the 90 angle from the line to the center of the ball so if ball's center is outside the end of the line ball will pass through. I could mathematically make longer line or calculate this in but the thing is when ball hits the line with center outside it behaves (bounces off) totally differently than when it hits the flat surface of a line. This is basically circle to point collision and response which should be not so hard to do, but there are other cases for example when ball rolls on line where this view on it wouldn't work. The thing itself didn't bother me (but I am making it so I don't know how players will percieve it) and added a little to the "ah" moment which is good in games :) so I didn't plan to nudge it with this version. Because in next version I intend to use a 2d physics library and all this will go away and behave much better also.
     
  8. Maupin

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    I think players will find it tedious to continually redraw from scratch. I know I did. If you think it's too easy, just make the puzzles harder. ;)

    For this type of game, I think the moon should react as one would expect when a circle hits a line. Using a slightly longer line segment in your calculations would be better than having it pass through the edges, but the best solution is detecting all collisions (and bouncing off at wild angles if necessary).
     
  9. nino_rajacic

    nino_rajacic New Member

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    Nice game Janko,

    I really like idea, it still have bugs, but you're on good way to go.
    Nice work! :)


    Nino Rajacic
    composer / sound designer
    www.3peakaudio.com
     
  10. jankoM

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    As simple as your "make the puzzles harder" sounds, you actually have a very good point that changes the focus of challenge "from be careful when you draw lines" to "try to find a solution with smallest ammount of lines" in very important way. The first one, if I say it that way surely doesn't sound ANY fun. Another person on TIG forums told me the similar thing. So I will change this and make the levels harder and line limit more lower. THANKS!

    About edges I will see what I will do ... it also depends if I will change lines to for example clouds which are more "analog" or something else.

    Thanks Nino, although I always say I want critical feedback this is what I really want to hear :D (joking a little)
     
  11. jcottier

    jcottier New Member

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    coming back about the amount of lines.... May be you should start with just one type of line.... then add the other one only if they are required to solve the game.

    JC
     
  12. AlexWeldon

    AlexWeldon New Member

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    Tough game. I found it a little easier when I realized that the key was to draw one line first, play it, see where he goes, then draw your second line, rather than trying to plan out a whole series of bounces from the start.

    I did find a collision bug, though, when the ball hits the very tip of a line. Try this code and watch what happens when he hits the third line:

    {level}{ball x='262' y='82' /} {star x='158' y='247' /} {star x='264' y='205' /} {star x='364' y='253' /} {line bounce='1' x1='321' y1='305' x2='246.141754260043' y2='345.26466248134' /} {line bounce='1.5' x1='102' y1='204' x2='116.771753382269' y2='287.706602499525' /} {line bounce='0.61' x1='367' y1='149' x2='433.373848802658' y2='202.099079042126' /} {/level}

    I guess you need to test the velocity angle vs. the line angle when a collision is detected and just ignore it if it seems like he's hitting the wrong side of the line.
     

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