Life after the video game crash

Discussion in 'Indie Related Chat' started by Sparks, Jul 28, 2006.

  1. Sparks

    Original Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2005
    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    0
  2. Ricardo C

    Original Member

    Joined:
    Sep 11, 2004
    Messages:
    1,349
    Likes Received:
    3
    I haven't read it the whole way through, but it sounds as though his undderstanding of the industry's history is more than a little off. I think he has a point regarding increasing development expendituresand the subsequent losses, but his overall argument seems flawed.

    It reads like one of those pseudo-luddite whines about how DVD is great and no one really needs HDTV, because the leap from 480p to 1080p is nothing like the leap from VHS to DVD.
     
  3. Sparks

    Original Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2005
    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    0
    I dunno, somehow the question he raises are philosophical of nature, but on the other hand: why not admit from time to time that its all a big fat marketing hype ?
    People are driven into buying hardware all the time because the industry makes it harder to use newer software with older hardware.And the industry doesn't do it because it is technically necessary, but because it causes revenue.
    Instead of truly innovating, they just throw more power at it.
    I just saw the trailer for mass effect and MoH:Airborne.
    While MA seems to add innovation, MOH is just adding more realism.
    I had already my problems with the landing at Omaha beach in MOH:AA, and now I can buy a game that shows me even MORE realistically how it is to shoot and kill.As if CNN wasn't enough.
    I think his point is pretty interesting, that games and movies are two different things, and that You can rewatch movies but not so much replay games.
    The only games I have played though several times are Dune, Pirates!, Indy 3 and 4, ELITE and strategy games, but those can hardly compare with films.
    I think games should not target movie goers, they should target readers.
    A visual sensation can wear off quicker than the neverending images Your mind creates, so games should rather motivate the mind instead of the eyes and thus gain more depth and replayability.
    It sounds odd, but I think that despite the fact that today a lot of games like FarCry imply higher leven AI and promise a different game experience everytime You start again, the good old text adventures truly were different to different people, because not two people see the same picture in their mind when they read a book.
     
  4. LilGames

    LilGames New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2006
    Messages:
    421
    Likes Received:
    0
    Among other things, the guy focuses a little too much on GRAPHICS. Comparing screenshots doesn't show much about GAMEPLAY. But apparently to this guy graphics are everything...
     
  5. soniCron

    Indie Author

    Joined:
    May 4, 2005
    Messages:
    3,664
    Likes Received:
    0
    Well, there's not much to talk about. I can sum it up for you: Shoot enemy. Pick up health. Repeat. There's a reason gaming isn't terribly popular -- it's not like gaming is a treasure trove of hidden gems. The best games of today are still mediocre at best. Even if some of these games could deliver a halfway decent story...
     
  6. Fry Crayola

    Original Member

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2004
    Messages:
    340
    Likes Received:
    0
    Summing up generic game actions in list form is hardly representative of the actual game, not to mention downright insulting in the form you've put it as you're effectively calling any gamer a simple-minded buffoon who derives entertainment from repetitive and uninspiring tasks.

    I could describe Ico as "pull bint around a level whilst hitting bits of shadow with a stick", but that'd miss the point with such amazing cack-handedness that I'd probably manage to kill myself in the process.

    If you click around the web, you can get the plot synopsis for a large range of films. They tell you what happened in general terms. Is that the same as watching the film? Is reading a list of notes the same as listening to the finished piece?

    Of course not. And games are no different. Maybe you personally aren't too enthralled with today's games - after all, a game's quality varies from person to person and what pushes my buttons might cause you to vomit in a small pool.
     
  7. Anthony Flack

    Indie Author

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2004
    Messages:
    2,176
    Likes Received:
    0
    How strange; games can be played for many hours and a good one may end up being replayed for a very long time. But it would be pretty exceptional to find a DVD you'd want to watch more than twice. That's why I've never really understood why people buy movies; unless you lend them to a lot of people they're only good for an evening.
     
  8. Ricardo C

    Original Member

    Joined:
    Sep 11, 2004
    Messages:
    1,349
    Likes Received:
    3
    I guess with Savant "retiring", someone needs to fill the "gratuitously antagonistic guy" role ;)
     
  9. arcadetown

    Moderator Original Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2004
    Messages:
    1,476
    Likes Received:
    0
    Perhaps also the game just sucked big time. I was part of a focus group for the Atari 800 version and man that was the most boring game I've ever seen to this date. Can't imagine how terrible/boring the 2600 version was.
     
  10. Anthony Flack

    Indie Author

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2004
    Messages:
    2,176
    Likes Received:
    0
    It sucked legendary suck. It was teh original suxx0r, I believe.

    So... this article; looks like another version of the older version of this article, but updated with some more recent events. I think it's very funny, and of course it's designed to be provocative. He makes good points, but content-wise, it's quite "fair and balanced" in the Fox News sense, and deliberately so.

    And why not? We need these kinds of prodding. Just look at how clod-headed Sony have been behaving recently. But still...
    That was a poor choice of example. I'm told that New Super Mario Bros has sold 145,095 copies in Japan, and the DS Lite has sold 262,000.

    If those numbers seem a little low, keep in mind I'm only talking about the past week.
     
  11. HairyTroll

    Original Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2004
    Messages:
    582
    Likes Received:
    0
    You obviously don't have children. I've watched Toy Story about a hundred gazillion times. And that's just this week.
     
  12. turbo

    Original Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2005
    Messages:
    63
    Likes Received:
    0
    I found it quite an entertaining read. :)

    - one thought I had though, is the author may a bit burnt out on gaming
    and as a young parent is more concerned with the stresses of real life.

    - another thought.. there are more types of games than he talks about.. lol
    (I would be bored with the ones he mentions too)
     
  13. cliffski

    Moderator Original Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2004
    Messages:
    3,897
    Likes Received:
    0
    Thats because kids learn through repetition. This is why sesame street (which repeats the same number for a whole program) is so successfull.
    So I read.
     
  14. soniCron

    Indie Author

    Joined:
    May 4, 2005
    Messages:
    3,664
    Likes Received:
    0
    *laughs* Well, I'm not trying to be antagonistic. ;) I'm just extremely dissatisfied with the current state of gaming. The quality of the gaming experience has been declining since the mid '90's, and will continue indefinitely until they wake up.

    Don't get me wrong: There certainly are some excellent games out there. But the signal to noise ratio is simply appaling. I can't believe I'm the only one here who thinks this?
     
  15. Ricardo C

    Original Member

    Joined:
    Sep 11, 2004
    Messages:
    1,349
    Likes Received:
    3
    I think a lot of us feel the same way. But your analysis was very superficial, especially for those who played those games thoroughly. Telling me Goldeneye is just about the same as Red Faction is like saying Star Wars and 2001 are the same because they both take place in space and feature a villain with an iconic voice.
     
  16. Fry Crayola

    Original Member

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2004
    Messages:
    340
    Likes Received:
    0
    I'm not convinced that the quality's declining at the very top level - there's the same number of excellent games as there always was.

    But the "average" may well have dropped, thanks to the advent of 3D gaming and its greater reliance on AI to provide the challenge, as opposed to negotiating the level architecture. The difference between average and excellent AI is far more pronounced than that of average and excellent 2D platformer level design.
     
  17. berserker

    Indie Author

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2004
    Messages:
    670
    Likes Received:
    0
    Yeah, even me has a copy of both :)
    It was so hard to find in US - sold out almost at every shop.
    ________
    Class Action Lawsuit
     
    #17 berserker, Jul 30, 2006
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2011
  18. Anthony Flack

    Indie Author

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2004
    Messages:
    2,176
    Likes Received:
    0
    I had to find out when the shipments of DS Lites came in, and get there early to join the big queue of people buying them. They are sold out everywhere.
     
  19. LilGames

    LilGames New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2006
    Messages:
    421
    Likes Received:
    0
    You are coming off as a bit of a curmudgeon.

    There has ALWAYS been alot of signal to noise. Always. It's just very easy to only remember our favorite hits of the past and forget what crap was out there at the same time.
     
  20. soniCron

    Indie Author

    Joined:
    May 4, 2005
    Messages:
    3,664
    Likes Received:
    0
    You know how hard it is for me to find a good flick? Not very. Know how hard it is for me to find a good game? Terribly.
     

Share This Page

  • About Indie Gamer

    When the original Dexterity Forums closed in 2004, Indie Gamer was born and a diverse community has grown out of a passion for creating great games. Here you will find over 10 years of in-depth discussion on game design, the business of game development, and marketing/sales. Indie Gamer also provides a friendly place to meet up with other Developers, Artists, Composers and Writers.
  • Buy us a beer!

    Indie Gamer is delicately held together by a single poor bastard who thankfully gets help from various community volunteers. If you frequent this site or have found value in something you've learned here, help keep the site running by donating a few dollars (for beer of course)!

    Sure, I'll Buy You a Beer