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Discussion in 'Indie Related Chat' started by CousinGilgamesh, Jan 12, 2009.
Indeed. That's exactly my conclusion too.
Even "experimental" is dubious for YHTBTR, though since to a certain degree the whole point of the game is that it does nothing new or unexpected.
I'm usually not one who thinks the game industry should follow the movie industry but in this case maybe the IGF needs a category or even a set of subcategories that is the equivalent of the "shorts" movie categories so games like this can be recognized for existing but also be recognized as a shorter experience than a full game.
FWIW I also agree the entrance fee is fine and needed to filter out the real drek and $100 seems like a good price, at least here in the US.
That really through me for a loop, how can a game like YHTBTR got on, but things like Zero Gear or Salvation Prophecy did not. It was however a well polished game and had a good funny song at the end.
Sure it is. To use your own analogy, they called it a Cat Show and then awarded a Dog the prize!
After publicising the fact that it was actually a dog show.
I can see that's enough for some people to start flaming, especially if they didn't get the memo and thought it was actually a cat show. It must suck to be one of those guys, especially if you paid your entry fee with the expectation that you'd be in the running for the Innovation award - er, I mean the cat show.
However, to completely rubbish the IGF as a "joke" and decide to boycott it as a result based on a single category being misleading named is overly harsh, I think.
You've made many good points in this thread. It's a careful balance of wanting to support the IGF yet pushing them to make improvements in various areas.
It doesn't help that these improvement areas are rather serious. I find it a little surprising that the Independent GAME Festival has been running for ten years now, yet on the surface some of its members can't demonstrate an understanding of the difference between interactive art, cleverware, and GAMES. I mean come on, is the definition of "game" really that elusive?
I want to give the IGF the benefit of the doubt, here. Maybe the problem is with the nominating process. Out of the 100 or so IGF judges, only 5-10 of them pick the nominees. That sounds potentially broken. I seriously doubt YHTBTR would have been nominated if all available judges had a say in the process. I know that's not practical with the 100s of submissions you get, but the point is pretty clear. Those 5-10 guys should be cream of the crop judges who can demonstrate the ability to separate non-games from the games.
simonc, if you're still reading and want to know the effect this has had on us: We really want to enter the IGF (maybe next year), but at this point we are just looking for gimmicky/wacky crap to add to our game to get your attention. Because frankly, I don't think innovations in actual gameplay alone will get us noticed. I was already starting to feel this way last year (physics + clever UI design != gameplay, nor are clever algorithms for generating content; both of those should have been technical nominees, not best indie game overall), and this year IMHO is even worse.
I really want the IGF to continue to grow, but things need to be more focused IMHO.
Really well said.
Since we're requesting things from the IGF guys, can the requirement to be on site, or have a friend in the US, if you get into the finals be removed? In today's financially pressured environment, it's just not a doable thing for some of us outside of the US. Not specificlally talking about what I do here- IGF should showcase the very best, not just the very best who can afford to meet the entrance requirements.
And yes, I mention this every year
I agree about the requirement to be on site, it seems a bit harsh considering the prize amount and the economic climate.
Regarding the judging - considering each submission is paying $95 shouldn't that cover the cost of getting the game judged fairly?
Well we can all rest easy now that YHTBTR didn't take home the innovation award. Thank you Jason Rohrer for making Between