Google Games....

Discussion in 'Indie Related Chat' started by Indiepath, Jul 11, 2010.

  1. FlySim

    Indie Author

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  2. princec

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    Googlewhack!

    Cas :)
     
  3. Applewood

    Moderator Original Member Indie Author

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    I don't think it counts when you make your own :) (I'll take it though)

    I guess you can't actually have more than one tnettenba then...
     
  4. zoombapup

    Moderator Original Member

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    You know I remember reading this interesting thing, I think it was in a book by Al Reis, about the creator of garfield. He basically chose to create a character that wasnt flashy or over-the-top and his reasoning was exactly the same. He said that if you want to have a big impact for a short time, you get REALLY popular because you are fashionable, but similarly once something is fashionable it can then become out of fashion. If you want to keep doing the same thing for a long time you create something with inherent value.

    It feels like this situation applies. Facebook is all the rage now, but I highly doubt that it will remain so. Either people will lose interest (because fundamentally the only reason to be on facebook is to play games) or will simply move on to the next best thing(tm).
     
  5. cyodine

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    Yep, I'm still waiting for my Caprica Holobands and all the virtual interaction rooms.
     
  6. hippocoder

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    I don't think facebook's a fad. I did think myspace was shit and a fleeting thing. I thought yahoo was ok but the fact was google was doing it better.

    Social networks isn't about doing it better, its about keeping it simple... Thats why ICQ died. They kept adding layer upon layer of bullshit to it.
     
  7. JGOware

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    "because fundamentally the only reason to be on facebook is to play games"

    I disagree. There's a huge based of users who's primary use of FB is for keeping in touch with family members. It's a great system for posting pics, events, updates, etc, etc.
     
  8. lightassassin

    lightassassin New Member

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    Isn't facebook doing excatly that though? Adding layer upon layer. Remember the outrage when they changed the UI a bit? and now with all the privacy changes.

    I'm not a facebook fan, and it reminds me of myspace so much right now. Difference is it has far more cross-linking between people. I hate the spam from all the games all the time and I log in maybe once a couple of weeks or so.
     
  9. Jack Norton

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    I agree with Cliff. Just think about Twitter! Only few years ago nobody was using it and when I saw it I thought "what an useless thing!".
    Now I use it a lot and have many followers / follow many people. In computers there's hardly anything "immutable" ;)
     
  10. dewitters

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    There is one big difference between that and Facebook: I can switch search engines without problems, or buy a computer for any manufacturer. What I can't do is switch from Facebook, because all my friends are already on Facebook, sharing their foto's etc. Facebook has a strong network effect, and so a strong customer lock-in. Once it's the most popular, it's easy to remain in that position.

    See this article of Joel, Facebook is definitely using the Amazon model, even more than Amazon itself ;).
     
  11. ggambett

    Moderator Original Member Indie Author

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    Yeah, except all your info can be accessed by the API if you authorize it - so a FB killer would just have to add an option to "import your profile". That doesn't remove the lock-in but it does make migration somewhat easier.
     
  12. princec

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    Except... Facebook is good. The reason Myspace died a death is because Facebook was simply implemented rather better for rather more people. I just simply don't have any reason to go anywhere else, the same way I don't have any reason to use any other VOIP than Skype, or any IM other than MSN. What's there is basically Just Right.

    Cas :)
     
  13. zoombapup

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    I agree with you on that count. Facebook is pretty good for what it does. But the "fashion" thing still holds. Its currently fashionable to have all your mates on facebook and all of that. But who really *really* gives a toss about whats happening on facebook?

    Once all of your mates get bored of updating and everyone accepts that its just another skype or IM, then it will inevitably not be that interesting anymore. That will likely impact a fair bit on the traffic volume and pull of the concept. Currently they mitigate that with games (because games have significant stickyness).

    There's a reason why games are in people's firing line. They never expected it, but they know that games are inherently sticky to an audience, where as most other things (like random friends updates) arent.

    I think Nicholas Lovell is actually pretty much on the money here:

    http://www.gamesbrief.com/2010/07/c...ogles-secret-investment-in-zynga-suggest-not/
     
  14. Bad Sector

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    As a protocol and clients,*there are much better and more reliable alternatives (even ICQ is more reliable). But everyone, including myself, uses MSN instead. Why? Simply because everyone has MSN while very few use other IM services.

    But MSN's service is the worst of all. I always have messages getting dropped (not reaching the other end) in random occassions, people having connection issues, etc. I use Adium, so i can have multiple IMs from a single app, and i use MSN, ICQ and Google Talk. Only MSN has these issues.

    Yet it is the most popular because... it was the most popular :p.

    (ok, when introduced, MSN was better than ICQ -the only real alternative then- with server-stored contact lists and a very lightweight client, but since then things changed)
     
  15. andrew

    andrew New Member

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    That won't work. FB is picky about how their data is accessed and stored. Until very recently, you had to requery their servers every 24 hours for even the most basic profile information. I highly doubt they'd let some competitor just scrape their database at will...

    The interesting question re: Zynga is how much of their player data is actually owned by Zynga and not just cached copies of FB-owned data. In some sense you have to keep pinging FB for data because friend connections change, pictures change, app users change, etc. I'm not sure how they would migrate the graph to Google, although they'd have a good infrastructure for essentially building a new one...

    - andrew
     
  16. tentons

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    I use it because my friends/family are available in a way that's convenient for me. It's never made me feel cool because it's more of a utility than anything (like email).

    That's selling it a bit short, isn't it? :)

    I don't think my mom, for example, is doing it to be cool nor will she tire of communicating with family and friends. It's supplanting email and phone in a lot of cases. I use it in lieu of email often (particularly with my kids). It's the easiest way to keep track of people you care about without a lot of effort. That's a huge thing.

    If Facebook dies some day, there will surely be something similar to replace it, because at this point it's indispensable to many people.

    Well, all speculation, but just wanted to put a different point of view out there.

    Zuckerburg said that games were a surprise to him, so I think they've certainly shifted to support that, but I don't think that was ever an intended "core" use of the service.

    And I believe Facebook could survive without games, but it would make a ton less money. Only about 50% of Facebook users play games (you can dig up that stat on Google).

    Again, just my $.02 from my usage of the site.
     
  17. Swattkidd

    Swattkidd New Member

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    I agree with what most of you are saying, that when Myspace was big nobody thought it would ever die and the same could happen to Facebook, however I think Facebook is a bit different.

    Myspace was a place where a bunch of teens went to try and be cool and pimp out their profiles and post glitter graphics. Having that kind of user is terrible because those are the ones that jump over to anything to be cool (they all jumped over to Facebook when it was open to public). However Facebook now has them, and their original user base of college students along with their parents, aunts, uncles, grandparents etc. And that is what I think is the most critical part, these are people whom will probably NEVER switch as it must have been a pain to learn to use Facebook in the first place. (They probably learned, Windows->Firefox->Email->Facebook) and now they are set, everything they will ever need.
     
  18. Qitsune

    Qitsune New Member

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    I don't know that Myspace compares very well with Facebook.
    I never had any use for Myspace, I put a profile up, and some images I worked on as a kind of portfolio and friended a big bunch of ppl. The only messages I ever got on my wall were spam and I never used it to replace e-mail or phone or anything. Now I only use it to check out bands because of the music hosting thing, a lot of indie bands still use it as their profile/portfolio/place to post tour dates.

    Now, Facebook, I use it to replace e-mail. I'm having a housewarming party soon, all the guests except 2 were invited through a fb event. I use it to track birthdays, plan weekends, keep track of old friends who live far, discover new music and network with other artists. I discovered that there are very few degrees of separation between me and some illustrators I really admire and I can interact with them, and pick their brains about art. It's great. It's useful. It answers a need I have. I block all games that my friends adopt as soon as they appear on my wall and I get very little spam now. I get way less spam there than from my e-mail. I hardly ever log on to MSN messenger anymore, no one I know ever logs on anymore. Everyone's on Facebook.
     
  19. zoombapup

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    I agree with what you guys are saying. Its a useful tool. But the question is how useful and to how many people over the longer term.

    Right now its fashionable to be on facebook and doing all sorts of random post crap with your mates.

    But the real question is how sticky will that be over the next few years?

    Personally I find facebook very spammy and even if these are updates from people I know, I really dont need to know theyre having a BBQ unless I'm invited (and given most of my friends are in different countries thats unlikely).

    Once some of the shine goes, the question is the utility and how theyre going to make it remain sticky. Right now a big part of that is games. But that could all go south if they mess with it too much.
     
  20. Applewood

    Moderator Original Member Indie Author

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    I can't stand the games either. I got hooked on mafia wars early on but I've not gone back to that for ages.

    I just don't want constant spam about sending my "friends" a pointless jpeg each time I click a button. Most of the "social" games on FB are way too over the top in their virality attempts and I think most will get bored of that.

    And no, I don't want to fill in 97 forms to get spammed for the rest of my life in return for a powerup that will probably never arrive or will be wank if it does.

    I'm sick of it as a games platform.
     

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