Game Composer Avaliable

Discussion in 'Music & Sound Portfolios' started by TwiTerror, Jul 16, 2005.

  1. luggage

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    I can't see what's wrong with keeping his prices low. It's entirely his perogative. If you're being honest the only reason you object is that you think he'll get more work as his price is cheaper. Competition actually improves things believe it or not.

    And it sounds like you're talking about price fixing. Highly dubious! :)
     
    #21 luggage, Jul 31, 2005
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2005
  2. Melin

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    Glad we agree.
     
  3. luggage

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    But that's all this is though, competition. I don't see why you're against his prices if you think compeition is a good thing then.

    Ferraris aren't trying to compete on a price point with Fiat.

    (not that you're the Fiat of the music world Josh :) )
     
  4. ManuelMarino

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    Hello, well, the price depends on many factors. I manage a studio in Italy and our lower overhead let us keep the prices low, compared to other usa and european studios. But prices are not "magic numbers" that studios decide one day... rely on costs, on overhead, on investments, involve evaluating product features and customer benefits and marking up your cost of production...

    But in Josh proposal... well, the price is irrelevant. $12 per track or $4 per minute means "I work for free, but I don't want people think I work for free".

    That is ok, since he is building a resume. Also, if he has money to invest on himself... let him invest the money. When you work for free, you invest money on you, because you can't cover any costs.
     
  5. sparkyboy

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    Well this is certainly an interesting thread!! ;)

    All I can say to those of you who think that Josh charging $12 per track or whatever is somehow insulting to other so called 'professional' musicians,let me just make a point as regards to myself(and others like me ;) ) for instance!

    I pretty much do not have 2 dimes to rub together.When I finish my next game (and god knows when that will be :D ),I'll be looking to add a few music tracks to finish it up.
    Now,what are my options.......hmmmm.....let me see now....
    1)Write the music myself........don't think so,I do not have a musical bone in my body!!

    2)Buy music from a pro studio......Again not an option due to cash(or lack thereof to be more precise).

    3)Don't use any music........Years ago maybe,these days I don't think so.

    4)Buy music from a startup musician..........Well what do you know,this is the option for me and other indies in my position.



    I appreciate too that everyone wants to make a living from their chosen profession,be it musician,graphics artist or programmer.
    However last time I looked we were living in a democracy where each individual has the right to decide for him/herself what they are going to do and how much they are going to charge others for their services.

    So if Josh or other startups want to give their work away or charge a nominal fee then its up to them and shouldn't be told what they SHOULD charge!!

    Stop belly aching and get on with being competetive!!

    P.S.
    I could make an analogy for the programmers and say that people who use tools such as MMF etc are being unfair to programmers who use C++ because they may be able to complete more games per year as a result.
    So what,as with everything we all live and die by our end product!!

    So just knuckle down and get on with your work and strive to be better than the next guy!!

    That's democracy,capitalism.......hell that's just LIFE!!!!

    Oh and Josh......Kudos and Good luck buddy!!!

    All the best


    Mark.
     
  6. soniCron

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  7. TwiTerror

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    Time for backstory?

    I have an alternate source of income at the moment, which is at a local swim club. I coach and lifeguard about 30~ hours a week. This gives me decent income that I can pay website bills and the car bills with pretty decently. What I save goes directly into my equipment. My final purchase for this recent shopping burst is going to be Garritan Personal Orchestra, because that whole idea tickles my fancy. (You can go on an open a whole new debate about that software if you really feel like it, but I'm not trying to provoke anything. Suggestions are welcome though!)

    Anyway, the music is what I would really enjoy doing full-time, but it's just not a possibilty. The days I request off from my local job I dedicate to working on music. I try to work in the night at the club when I do work, so that I can write music when my creative mind is at it's peak in the morning.

    Thing's seem to work out hand in hand. This is why these rates are possible, and I'm not just trying to flaunt around my music 'for free so people don't think it's free.' Instead, I'd just like people to put there money where my experience is. I don't claim, nor think, that I'm any 'Fiat' of the music world. Quite the contrary (this may even shoo away buisness), but that's what I'm here to work on. And I figured that there is no better place to start than at an Indie Gamer community. Sure, I could raise my prices, but how many developer's here can afford $40. I try to provide solutions for those who aren't expecting great success. And the ultimate goal is, that maybe, with my music, their game will do better, and ultimately sell more. Making everybody happy, as I see it.

    That is my, obviously, much greater than 2 cents. And yes, Melin and I do go back, and I still highly reccommend him to anybody who finds his samples and prices in their range.

    My price WAS recently raised (but only to $25/$10 ($10 only usually being applied to 4min+)) to counter some of these arguments. But it does come to mind that I cannot please everybody (why not try, though?). For the sake of things, I still find $25/$10 insane, even though if you mention this thread you can sneak the $12/$4. And maybe, when I have the experience that Melin carries, I can really put some bang in my eigth notes.

    Thanks again,
    Josh Whelchel
     
  8. ManuelMarino

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    Josh, my post didn't was a criticism... I was trying to explain a situation that every musician faced in his career (especially at the beginning).

    I only stepped in about the prices discussion because when you manage a studio things are more complicated, and it is useful, I think, to explain the logic behind a price.

    Or people would think that paying for quality custom scores is an heresy :)

    Another example... I could be millionaire and with an architect degree. Since I have all the money to begin whatever enterprise without considering costs, investments, risks and so on I decide to design buildings for free.

    That is cool :D but doesn't mean that all the other architects are crazy because they ask a salary.

    Doesn't mean also that this is a market rule, competition and so on. You can't say to other architects: "Hey, focus on competition". Because it would be ridicolous. It's the "free or low price" logic that must be considered uncommon, or peculiar to specific situations, as when a musician like Josh is going to create a resume.

    The problem in music industry is that P2P, music piracy and so on is going to create the idea that music MUST be for free. It is not.

    And asking a very low price is not "competition"... is just the way a musician like Josh, at the beginning of his career, is following to create his resume and to show his talent to people.

    That's all... and I approve it... no need for a flame war ;)
     
  9. Melin

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    This discussion has gone way over hand.
    All the best to you josh, I hope you'll score a couple of deals in the near future.

    Just a side note about Garritan Personal Orchestra. I don't want to start a software based discussion, but I would highly advise you not to buy it. Yes, it's cheap, but it's cheap shit. The samples don't sound authentic whatsoever, did you even listen to the demos on the site? The brass is horrible. A few articulations of some string instruments are nice, but that's about it. Unless you have another library to back it up, it's not worth your money and time. Now if you've got the processor power to back it up, I'd aim for EWQLSO any day. The silver version is even on sale:
    http://www.soundsonline.com/sophtml/details.phtml?sku=EW-161

    The gold version is a bit pricy, but if you can afford it it's worth every penny.

    Good luck!
    Staffan Melin
    Melin Music
     
  10. bluejay

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    This forum seriously needs some moderating, I think we should go back to messages having to be pre-approved before showing up to make sure it's on topic.

    Most of the topics in this thread has nothing to do with people's work experiences with Josh but a bunch of OT stuff.
     
  11. ManuelMarino

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    If the topic would have been moderated, probably I wouldn't have the need to qualify some things. But these forums are public, so whatever you post must be clear and realistic or guests just browsing it would feel confused.

    As professionals we are obliged to keep statements clear and realistic.

    By the way, to go back on topic, Melin suggestion is correct, EWQL Symphonic Orchestra is one of the best, so go for it. If you can, I suggest also to build a custom database with your own samples.

    When you record yourself your samples, at 24Bits 96KHz, and the way you want... it's a totally different world. You could easily create an orchestral database of 100gb quality samples without buying East West samples and you would feel more motivated in your productions. Or do both things, of course :)
     
  12. whisperstorm

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    Hi Josh, I just wanted to tell you I really like your work and will be sending you inquiry's about a game I'm working on to see if you are interested in creating some tracks.
     

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