Area 61 - Hunt down aliens in this FPS.

Discussion in 'Announcements' started by PickleJarGames, Jun 29, 2008.

  1. PickleJarGames

    PickleJarGames New Member

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    >>Did not work in windowed mode.<<

    You must have selected the executable in the directory. Otherwise it should default to a fullscreen 800 by 600 resolution. The screens seem to show a higher resolution.

    >>The gun particle effects are kind of out of place.<<

    Thought that one would slide.

    >>Due to the texture problem the shaders do not help your game a lot.<<

    I think you folks are putting too much emphasis on the shaders. They are just shaders. But I'm not disagreeing with you.

    >>because i kept getting stuck in various corners.<<
    Yeah the radius for the player is 8 and the area to walk is 32, so pretty narrow. I play with a dual analog controller.

    Anywways, thanks, it seems that the simple collision detection is the main problem to be worked on.

    Thanks again.
     
  2. Nexic

    Indie Author

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    I've got to say that I also think Doom looks better, but that's not as big an insult as it sounds. I actually think a high % of indie games look worse than Doom and that's largely because Doom had a team of dedicated artists at it's disposal which a lot of people just don't have. Yes technology is better these days but if the base art isn't of good quality, lighting and shaders won't save it.

    Just finding some better textures would do this game the world of good.
     
  3. Applewood

    Moderator Original Member Indie Author

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    Because doom had elementary lighting that was used well. Your lighting is setup all wrong. Daylight just doesn't look like that, what can I tell ya. You should really put some cook-torrance on those metal bits too. And I only just noticed your game has shadows as they're so uber low-res they're hardly visible.

    Why do you keep saying stuff like that and then coming back ?
     
  4. PickleJarGames

    PickleJarGames New Member

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    >>as they're so uber low-res they're hardly visible.<<

    That proves to me you don't know what you're talking about. Don't give me advice about what shaders to use. I told you applewood, you do not impress me at all. What you don't get is that this game is complete done on to the next one.

    >>Why do you keep saying stuff like that and then coming back ?<<

    Theres your overly inflated ego. You think that you can have some last word that is a lesson to be learned.
     
  5. electronicStar

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    First I don't agree that Doom looks better than your game. Your game looks better just by vitrue of using a nicer engine. And I think there is potential in your graphics; if only you accept criticism and fix a couple of things you could have a very nice looking game.
    Only problem is that it looks bad because of several problems,notably with textures (the alien shines like plastic, textures aern't correctly aligned (see edges of metallic crate with "X" in the middle)). And lighting doesn't look realistic, doesn't matter which shaders you have used.
    By the way I must reiterate that parallax mapping will probably do absolutely nil with the floor texture you are using.

    If you are just releasing games for free and for fun, then you are definitely not on the right forum. I encourage you to come to the TIGSource forums where you'll certainly find a warmer welcome (no poo poo or big egos).

    [EDIT] BTW the alien model is nicely done, if it's your creation then congrats.
     
  6. PickleJarGames

    PickleJarGames New Member

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    >>If you are just releasing games for free and for fun, then you are definitely not on the right forum. I encourage you to come to the TIGSource forums <<

    Thanks! I've never even come across that forum, but I will. Thanks again.

    PS - The alien is not mine (nothing in the demo is) that's why I thought it would look nicer.
     
  7. Applewood

    Moderator Original Member Indie Author

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    Your're just making yourself look more and more stupid mate. I've been writing nextgen 3D engines for the best part of 15 years. If you think I know nothing about it, especially without even asking me a single question, that just proves how mind-meltingly stupid, arrogant and close-minded you can be.

    Well, either that or it's your ego not letting you actually leave in case all these people you don't care about might say something more. If you want to leave this thread, just leave. Or stop trying to get attention. Nobody here cares a toss whether you leave or not tbh. That may come as news.

    Is there a mute button for this twat ? I seriously don't want to read any more of his drivel
     
  8. superfrog

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    The game has a bad graphics, a bad ai and a bad collision detection system.

    sorry
     
  9. aiursrage2k

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    Never seen such a hostile forum.

    Maybe you should add a minimap. Collide and slide would be nice. I didnt really care for the bouncing
     
  10. Bad Sector

    Original Member

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    Programming-wise its not really bad. You need to increase the resolution of your shadows because you seem to use some sort of perspective shadowmaps and they 'swim' as you move around and that looks bad. However its an ok engine, there were worse engines :). Now you can concentrate a bit on implementing a better collision response method. This is a very good and easy method that i've used with success at the past and it can be used with any kind of world structure as long as you can get down to polygon level.

    Art-wise it sucks, but you know it :). However i couldn't see what problem Applewood had with the way the daylight looks - except the shadows which looked like they came from the opposite side of the sky than from the side were the sun is.

    As for the DOOM comparison, well yeah i believe DOOM looks better than your demo, although your engine seems capable to produce much much better results. Personally i don't think that using good art is that important for showcasing an engine because the people who will be interested in the engine will be able to see through the art about what the engine is capable of. When showcasing an engine you want it to be viewed by people who know about that kind of stuff, not 10yo gamers who get excided by flashy textures :).

    Gameplay-wise it was boring, but thats an engine demo not a game, so its ok.
     
  11. Applewood

    Moderator Original Member Indie Author

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    There are many, but the killer is the obvious ambient lighting and the fact that the shadows have a direction.

    Outdoor lighting obviously depends on the atmospheric conditions, but if you're just using the ambient model then all your light should be in the ambient. Well, most of it.
     
  12. Bad Sector

    Original Member

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    Again not sure what you mean by that :D

    You mean the existance of a single light (sun)? The low ambient value? Or...?

    The shot above shows the worst actually and when running in game you don't notice much of this (well, bouncing updown all the time probably helps too).

    Btw, shadows in real life *DO* have a direction - they come from the sun which has a position in the sky therefore it casts shadows from somwhere :). Unless of course its in middle of the day. I can take a photo in a few hours to show you this :). Right now in Greece the sun is at the top of the sky so the shadows look like projected on the XZ plane :p.
     
  13. Applewood

    Moderator Original Member Indie Author

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    There hardly is any ambient. Some angles are much darker than others, which just doesn't match outdoor environments in any conditions.

    Actually, most of the lighting comes from the sky, not the sun. (please no pedantry). And given the maths, that'll give you a very small shadow right under your object.

    Compare and contrast the shadows in most car games with what you see in front of you next time you're driving down the (real) road. You'll be amazed how little shadow there is *under* the car, nevermind to the side of it.
     
  14. Bad Sector

    Original Member

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    Ah, yes i agree with that. Some extra ambience would make it much better. I think i saw somewhere a lighting tutorial for Unreal 1 engine that was about outdoor lighting with results that were very impressive. Although it was for an old engine (the tutorial is sort of new), the concept was for local lighting model so it will mostly apply for realtime lights.

    Depends on the conditions. Here are three photos i took just a couple of minutes ago from my apartment:

    [​IMG]

    As you can see there are hard shadows with a clear direction :)
     
  15. Applewood

    Moderator Original Member Indie Author

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    It does depend on the conditions. It's clearly getting near sunset where you are, and in a very bright country! Right now it's grey and overcast here and the concept of shadows doesn't exist :(

    Now show me three more when the sky looks like that in the original game pic. I'm not being pedantic - the human brain is very susceptible to this kinda stuff. You can get away with bad 'cast' shadows but only if the 'ambient lighting' shadows are right.

    When you have neither correct, like in the original "game", it looks appalling. And is mainly why doom looks better - nothing is jarring the brain because there's no obviously massive diffuse light sources
     
  16. Bad Sector

    Original Member

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    Well its not near sunset, i took them around one and a half hour ago and there is still plenty of light (and shadows) outside :). The sky *now* looks like the game's sky (minus the clouds). It'll take another two or three hours for sunset. I'm not sure what time of day the "original game" was supposed to be, but its clearly supposed to be in a bright day. In the middle of the day, when the sun is at the top, the shadows still exist but their direction is "down".

    However what you say is truly correct. HL2 has plain projected shadows to the ground below the characters as if the lightsource was above their head and nobody said anything about HL2 looking bad :). People expect to see shadows, but they go only that far. How these shadows look is another matter :D
     
  17. dpadam450

    dpadam450 New Member

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    First, I check here not too often. I'm about non-indie game development, but I still stop by.

    This thread is retarded. And I know that I am not any better for posting this, but:

    PickleJarGames:

    Mattias first reply to this post was perfectly fine. For needing SM 2.0 and stating those effects, they are kinda hard to see. And while SM 2 cards are cheap, still lots of older/indie gamers do not have them.

    The lighting is weird, but to say it looks worse than Doom just cuz of proper outdoor lighting is stupid and an insult. I played the game for a few minutes and it seems to be about 3 weeks worth of stuff, so all is well thus far.

    Your saying your 30+ years old, but I couldn't imagine a grown man complaining on the internet. Why would you care what other ppl say on the internet so much? Essentially you two should stop cuz you cant prove anything online.

    Your ego is too big tho, PixelJar. Come back with more impressive work if you want to please ppl. Typically when I see programmers make parallax mapping it at least looks like this:

    http://www.ozone3d.net/demos_projects/images/parallax_bump_mapping/parallax_bump_mapping.jpg

    ,which again, Mattias stated that your effects are hard to see. For reference, I'm 22, and I'm not gonna be back here for a while to read this forum so dont bother posting pissed off comments at me.

    -----------------------------
    http://p-o-p-games.50webs.com
    http://p-o-p-games.50webs.com/projects.html
     
  18. JGOware

    Indie Author

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    I wanted to run this, but it's too much for my casual dev kit. :(
     
  19. Bad Sector

    Original Member

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    @dpadam450:
    You're not communicating through SMS, please type the full words, thank you :).

    How expressing your opinion about something (especially when you were asked for it) is stupid and an insult (in fact, how can anything like this be an insult?)?

    Now really, nobody said anything about the algorithm used below. The algo is of course more complicated that what DOOM used. What people said is that DOOM's looked *better*. That is because it was fine tuned by the artists. DOOM3's lighting is far more complicated than HL2's lighting yet HL2 looks better in most cases because the artists fine tuned the lightmaps.

    More technically impressive doesn't always equal better aesthetic results.

    (of course personally i don't find most shaders impressive - i'm more impressed by the general design of an engine - and as such i don't find impressive that someone wrote a normal/parallax mapping shader. The only shader i found impressive as of late is the SSAO that was used in Crysis)

    Three weeks, one day, four years, whatever :). Who cares? The result is what matters mostly. While i suspect that most people with decent knowledge would need (at most) three weeks for that result, it matters not to those who will play the game. Its not like people won't notice the flaws or the flaws will be perceived better if the game was made in a shorter time.
     

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