Tavern with gambling as sub-game inside of a main game, player age problem

[Mark_Tempe]

I have a week spat for taverns in real life as well as in my games. My games have usually
A world to explore and places to visit ( upgrade shops , taverns , banks etc.. ). By far my favorite are taverns , places where you can have a drink , gamble away your hard earned (in game) money, ask about some information , for a price. From a game logic point of view it is also very useful, it allows a excess money to exit the game and in case of a big win it allows a player to jump over to a higher weapon/upgrades without working for it. A very satisfying experience for a player. A profile system discourages saving only when you win and starting from earlier save when you loose. So all the peaces fit nicely.

HERE IS MY PROBLEM:

The theoretical demographics of the game I am currently making is:
80% of what I think my target is will be man and boys ages 8 to 35.
I know my sun age 8 enjoys playing the game ( the tavern is off limits for him )
And old players like me who use to loose a fortune on Arkanoid and Galaga playing on game machines in Kmart . Few people in between.

20% women who enjoy an occasional arkanoid clone but usually not in a SF setting. Game is not really geared for them but who knows.

The game as far as colors and graphics goes is in part geared towards kids 7 and up and I really do not want to expose them to possibility of having an alcoholic drink or gambling in my game.

MY TWO UNSATYSFACTORY SOLUTIONS:

Create two versions of a game one with a safe tavern for kids and the other with fun tavern for adults

Create a password method for parents to enforce a safe tavern on their kids. This I can imagine will unlash a tornado of costumer support issues ex: I lost my password !!!

I have thought for a while about this and can not find a satisfactory solution.

I would appreciate ideas and feedback. Maybe someone has seen a solution to a similar problem

P.S.

I ma relatively unknown on this forum so if you are wandering what was my other game with taverns , banks , upgrade shops , starships and aliens it was Heliosfera published in Poland in 1996 on Amiga

________________________________________
Hunique Games
Huge and Unique Science Fiction and Fantasy Games

[spellcaster]

So, your games don't have potions either, I guess?
And no killing?

Sounds interesting.

[Hiro_Antagonist]

I guess my reaction is: What's the big deal?

RGP's and strategy games have had taverns in them ever since the genres existed, and I guess I don't see why it's a problem.

Although gambling with real money is reserved for people over an age threshold, video games with gambling content (poker games, casino games, etc.) are generally rated as 'E', right?

The "New Super Mario Bros" that came out a couple of days ago has 3 "Table Games" in the mini-games section, and those games are gambling games that feature Luigi as a dealer, dealing you cards for the 3 games in a casino. At least one of the games lets you explicitly raise your bet if you think you're going to win. All of these games cost you coins to try, and you win coins if you win.

Taverns exist in real life. Adults drink in them. That's what they're for. Kids know this, and it's been portrayed in books/games/movies available to kids for as long as I've known. Heck, even 90% of Casablanca was set in a bar with gambling in the back, and that's pretty family-friendly fare, right?

I would think that a label somewhere making clear that gambling and drinking are portrayed may be enough.

But you could also probably dodge much of the issue by simply referring to the alchohol as 'drinks', and as long as you don't show any blatent drunkenness or anything, then you're not even necessarily portraying alchohol consumption. (Look at Wild West Wendy and other ambiguous sources as examples.)

[Sirrus]

Taverns exist in real life. Adults drink in them. That's what they're for. Kids know this, and it's been portrayed in books/games/movies available to kids for as long as I've known. Heck, even 90% of Casablanca was set in a bar with gambling in the back, and that's pretty family-friendly fare, right?

So are Strip clubs. And what kids watch Casablanca?


Why not just call it an Inn? Usually Inns and Taverns serve the same purpose in games.

[Mark_Tempe]

After reading replies and thinking it over I am starting to think that simple new option in an options menu of REGULAR TAVERN and KID FRIENDLY TAVERN would be enough.

In regular tavern would be switched on you would have all the standard options :

Buy a drink for 50 credits
Play Martian roulette for 100 credits
Play Martian roulette for 1000 credits
Play Martian roulette for 5000 credits

If you switched on the options menu to a ‘kid friendly tavern’

Those option would change to:

Order Venusian sushi for 100 credits
Etc…
Etc…
Etc…

Other options would stay the same like asking for location of the starship upgrades for example.

Actually I would be inclined to a little more aggressive method like password system but that will just create a landslide of costumers who forgot their password.

In this solution there is nothing to prevent a kid from switching back to Standard Tavern after parent has left the room, but this I think is more of the parenting issue then a software problem.

Redesigning tavern to a bartering system for example is out of the question, because the game is already in closed beta. I will add some things to a game but there is no way I will redesign the whole tavern from scratch, after it is already balanced with economy of a game.

Above solution is best I can come up with for a moment,
If someone has a better idea I’m all ears
Thank You all again for the replies

________________________________________
Hunique Games
Huge and Unique Science Fiction and Fantasy Games

[Hiro_Antagonist]

So are Strip clubs. And what kids watch Casablanca?

Strip clubs aren't generally portrayed too often in kid-friendly movies/books/games. Bars/taverns quite frequently are. Even recent Disney movies (Three Musketeers, Pirates of the Caribbean) have bar scenes with adults drinking. I can't recall any kid-friendly media with strip clubs... examples?

As for Casablanca -- probably not too many kids watch it these days, but back in the day it was pretty popular and to my knowledge it's widely considered family friendly...

[Artinum]

Younger children certainly should have little idea why adults drink. Alcohol is unknown to them - these drinks are off limits but they don't know why. Children tend to choose drinks by taste. They don't understand that there is another reason until they get a little bit older.

If your in-game drinks have no inebriating effects, and you avoid the names of more, erm... exotic cocktails, you should have no problems.

As for gambling, that shouldn't be a problem either. No real money changes hands, after all, making this more of a sub-game. If you avoid typical games such as poker or roulette, you probably won't get any comment at all - no-one can call "snap" gambling! I mean, I'm not aware of Final Fantasy VIII getting any anti-gambling complaints despite the card games in that. Because adults didn't recognise it? (Or maybe these complaints were drowned out by the ones about summoning demons?)

[Mark_Tempe]

OK I get the sarcasm

The thing is the game world I created can not exist without ships exploding and a possibility of loosing your own skip/life. It can exist without possibility of having a drink in a tavern and gambling.

P.S.
Drinking a potion and drinking a shooter is quiet different trust me on this

[Mark_Tempe]

May be this is not such a big deal. I have seen taverns in different games RPG games. But no explicit drinking and gambling in titles for small kids. This has bothered me for a while. That's why the post

[spellcaster]

Drinking a potion and drinking a shooter is quiet different trust me on this

So hard drugs are ok, soft drugs aren't?

[Hiro_Antagonist]

May be this is not such a big deal. I have seen taverns in different games RPG games. But no explicit drinking and gambling in titles for small kids. This has bothered me for a while. That's why the post

So just to make sure I understand correctly:

On one hand, you're saying your target audience is for people/kids 8 and up, and you included colorful graphics to help appeal to the younger side of that audience.

On the other hand, you want to portray drinking and gambling, which you personally feel is inappropriate for kids.

That seems analagous to me saying I want to make a game that targets women, but I really want to show lots of boobs and make tons of fart jokes.

I guess what I'm getting at is that (IMHO) maybe a trip back to the drawing board is in order, other than trying to figure out complicated password systems to lock kids out (which I agree is a very unsatisfactory idea... =)

[spellcaster]

Yeah, see, hacking and slaying, killing people to get their stuff, robbing chests, etc. is ok. Same for using magic, drugs and substances equal to anabolic steroids etc.

But gambling.. pure evil.

In other words: Drawing the line isn't that easy