Self Publishing vs. Portals

[PlasticOstrich]

I know this has been done to death. It seems like there's polarized opinions.

To simplify for us noobs, for those of you who both self publish and use portals, are the sales figures really different? Does the genre of game make a difference (ex. mainstream vs. original).

I admit, as a noob it looks attractive to just work through portals, since they already have a customer base and can reach a lot more people. Also, they have a drm, and manage the business end of things, which is convienent.

However, I've read that lots of you feel it's just smarter and more profitable to really be "indie." Is this true even when you're new on the scene?

[jpoag]

Why not both?

A portal is a portal, not necessarily a publisher. Try to release simultaneously across all portals when you do to keep one portal from being mad at you and delaying.

[Nexic]

1. If you go portal only, you have no freedom over your content. You have to make an ultra casual bore-fest or you won't make any money. If you make anything else you'll be lucky to even make a few $100.

2. If you go portal only, you'll be forced to sell your game for $6.

3. If you go portal only, you won't build up any customers, so every title will be just as hard to sell as the first.

4. If a major portal says no to your future game you're totally screwed.

5. If a major portal decides they want to give you a smaller cut, your only choice is to say 'thank you sir, may I have another?'

6. Portals won't do any promotion of your game outside their site. You'll be missing out on 1000s of potential customers.

7. Your chances of making decent money on the portals are tiny. If you don't sell amazingly well in the first 24 hours you'll be dumped in the back of their catalog forever, earning about $3 per month.

8. The 'business side of things' isn't really that hard, and is actually a lot of fun. Don't knock it until you've tried it.

Chasing portal sales left me struggling for 3 years. Only when I started focusing on building my own customer base did I start making serious money. I know far more people who have made it big with direct sales than I do people who did it via portals.

I would say do both, but that's what I tried and it left me in a mindset of 'portals first, direct sales second' which ultimately made my games unineresting. Make sure you focus on your direct business first, then once the game has already been about for about 6 months think about putting on the portals for a nice little bonus.

[PlasticOstrich]

Thanks for the input. Very reasonable advice.

(Nexic -- great zombies)

[Spaiz]

Go with portals and your own web site.

[jpoag]

I second Nexic's advice. Most portals are like bargain bins. When a DVD comes out, it's full price. After the initial sales decline, they leave the shelves for the bins.

What is also interesting is after the portals, you could get into Shockwave Unlimited to squeeze out some more blood.

Then, after the initial title is exhausted, try pairing it with the sequel at launch as a point-of-sale cross promotion.

[Shaz]

Make sure you focus on your direct business first, then once the game has already been about for about 6 months think about putting on the portals for a nice little bonus.

If portals are hesitant to accept a game if it's been out on another portal for some time already, will they also be hesitant to accept it (or maybe not give it much focus) if it's been out on your own site for 6 months?

[Executrix]

If portals are hesitant to accept a game if it's been out on another portal for some time already, will they also be hesitant to accept it (or maybe not give it much focus) if it's been out on your own site for 6 months?

If portals don't want your game because it's been out on your own site for a while, then they are honestly not worth dealing with. BFG will always distribute a good game on their site even if it's already been exclusive on other sites, while sites like Reflexive won't accept your game if it has ever been exclusive. Which portal is crap?

[BlueFooted]

Isn't it a bit more complicated than this? I would think that what type of game you are making would have a lot to do with it. How many have success selling casual games (HO, M-3, TM, etc.) on their own sites? And how many zombie shooters make it to #1 on BFG?

1. If you go portal only, you have no freedom over your content. You have to make an ultra casual bore-fest or you won't make any money. If you make anything else you'll be lucky to even make a few $100.

I happen to really enjoy playing Match-3 and Hidden Object games, so I thought it would be fun to try to make one. Left 4 Dead sounded pretty boring to me on the other hand. I'm not trying to be inflammatory, just saying different strokes for different folks

[nateistoraw]

I say, use both wisely!

[Imphenzia]

I am also quite curious about portals. I decided to self publish "Beat Ball 2" and my main reason for doing so was to channel everyone to promote imphenzia.com and also because I had already built my registration key functions and process when I was about to launch the game.

For the past couple of years I have wondered whether launching it through portal(s) would have been more successful.

[Nexic]

I happen to really enjoy playing Match-3 and Hidden Object games, so I thought it would be fun to try to make one. Left 4 Dead sounded pretty boring to me on the other hand. I'm not trying to be inflammatory, just saying different strokes for different folks

No problem. I would just guess most developers don't aspire to making those sorts of games. More likely they get boxed into making them because they've been told it's the only way to make money. If you're truely passionate about casual games then by all means make them, but I'm pretty sure most developers dream of something different.

Isn't it a bit more complicated than this? I would think that what type of game you are making would have a lot to do with it. How many have success selling casual games (HO, M-3, TM, etc.) on their own sites? And how many zombie shooters make it to #1 on BFG?

There is no good reason for those casual titles not to have their own sites. The developers are blindly throwing money away and crippling their future profitability. Pure laziness.

For the past couple of years I have wondered whether launching it through portal(s) would have been more successful.

Well it might be more successful (no idea what your figures are) but I doubt it'd make any serious money on the portals. Breakout isn't really portal material anymore.

[jpoag]

No problem. I would just guess most developers don't aspire to making those sorts of games. More likely they get boxed into making them because they've been told it's the only way to make money. ....
There is no good reason for those casual titles not to have their own sites. The developers are blindly throwing money away and crippling their future profitability. Pure laziness.

Listen, I don't know this Nexic guy, but this is Nail-on-the-head stuff. Pure gold.

This has been my experience so far in the industry with two bestseller HO titles.

[cliffski]

That nexic guy knows his stuff.

[Jack Norton]

Most people are impatient. Casual and non casual. While I can't know it, the first few spidweb RPG probably didn't make much money.
But a long-lasting indie career is made building up a community/newsletter, loyal fan base, SEO, many links pointing to your site, a IP value that you can resell, and much more.
Using only portals, you get nothing else apart for the immediate money.

[jcottier]

Using only portals, you get nothing else apart for the immediate money.

Yes, but if you want to do that full time NOW, you haven't got a lot of options. You can't just hope than in 5 years time you'll get enough money.

Anyway, there is no reason to not do BOTH, self publish and use any other distributor you can put your hands on. It's all about building a lot of streams of money coming at you by bringing as many players in front of your games.

There isn't just one best way to do it. You have to find the right mix that works for you.

JC

[nadam]

I can just share my experience. Self publishing is a big fun for me so far.

I self published Foosball Maniac 2 weeks ago.
Here are my statistics so far:

604 visits to my page so far.
141 people downloaded the demo on my site.
Another 70 or more downloaded it from download sites like download.com
0 people bought the game. Not a dozen, not 2 or 1, but 0.
Only one review appeared on the game, but that is on a site without reasonable traffic. I've contacted something like 2 dozen journalists yet...

Probably my game is extremely shit, or maybe I suck at marketing, or both. I feel myself an alien now, because I happen to love to play with my own game. (Also there are people who said it is fun, but they were beta testers who had the full version for free, or ordinary players who said they don't have $10 for a small game.)

As for portals:
I've just contacted them 2 days ago. Only one portal answered so far, they said their core audience are more woman, and my game is more for young men, which is completely understandable.

[jcottier]

Jack, kind of miss read your post. Somehow, I didn't read the bold ONLY.

JC

[Jack Norton]

Yes the bold only was the keyword
I'd never straight publish on a portal even if I made a casual game, because releasing on your site first (beside obvious advantages) can also help you polish the game based on user feedback, and fix bugs, so that if some months later you want to try with portals, you have higher chances to have it accepted.

[berserker]

Probably my game is extremely shit, or maybe I suck at marketing, or both.

You have extremely low download numbers. You need thousands before expecting to see any sales.

[papillon]

604 visits to my page so far.

... in two weeks??

That would be your first problem.

[Rickard]

604 visits to my page so far.
141 people downloaded the demo on my site.
Another 70 or more downloaded it from download sites like download.com
0 people bought the game. Not a dozen, not 2 or 1, but 0.
Only one review appeared on the game, but that is on a site without reasonable traffic. I've contacted something like 2 dozen journalists yet...

Probably my game is extremely shit, or maybe I suck at marketing, or both. I feel myself an alien now, because I happen to love to play with my own game. (Also there are people who said it is fun, but they were beta testers who had the full version for free, or ordinary players who said they don't have $10 for a small game.)

What have you done to promote the game? I imagine it could sell if you find the right channels.
Look for sites and forums that are focused on foosball (in case you haven't already)
Maybe this could be a start?
http://www.foosball.com/
Maybe big a big retailer could be interested in some sponsorship in exchange for ads or something, or just drive traffic by having a free version on their site.

Rickard

[Nexic]

can just share my experience. Self publishing is a big fun for me so far...

Well, not to be rude but if you got zero sales directly with a football game, you aren't likely to get many on the portals either. This type of game is exactly the type of game that is more likely to do well direct.

Such a low number of visits sounds like you haven't done much in the way of promotion:

- Have you done a press release? If you don't have any contacts try a press release agency.
- Have you contacted football or table football related sites to ask if they will cover you?
- Have you tried buying banner ads on football related sites?
- Have you tried google adwords for football related keywords?
- Have you tried any search engine optimization for football related keywords?
- Have you tried posting about your game on football related forums?
- Have you made use of news sites like digg, stumbleupon, bored.com etc?

I'm not saying this stuff is going to magically solve your problems, but it would definitely help. My guess would be that the core game has some problems aswell.

EDIT: I played it and while it seems like a decent version of foosball it doesn't feel like you get much for your money. Feels like the kind of game you could play for free on a flash site. Hard to say what to improve as sports games aren't really my thing. I suggest taking a look at other popular sports games and see if anything can be replicated.

[nadam]

Thanks guys for helping me.

What I have done for promotion are just the trivial things, because I am a quite a beginner in this business:

- Mentioning the game in some gaming forums: Almost no attention.
- Mentioning the game in foosball forums: I've found two forums where people were interested, they are the ones who mostly downloaded the game. There were bad and good opinons mixed, but noone bought the game. Maybe foosball players are not used to paying for games online?
- Trying to 'spam' online gaming sites to ask for review, without success yet.
- Putting up the demo version to download sites such as soft32.com, brothersoft.com, wareseeker.com, download.com. (Although it appeared on download.com only yesterday, and on the other sites at the beginning of this week.)
- Tried to approach portals, although I understand that for most of them it might not fit their core audience.

Shall I just wait so that downloads on download sites will increase? Or shall I approach it a totally different way? I am on the border of just giving it up. I never wanted to be rich of my first game, but I thought I can sell it in 100 copies at least. Currently it seems that I was way way wrong.

Just to make it more fun: No sales yet, but I already had traffic from google with the search term 'foosball maniac registration key' Poor warez guy had not much chance.

[JoKa]

Don't expect too much of download sites, today their best effect is an increase in backlinks, good for serps. A press release is good for backlinks, too, but can have much more effect, if the right editors notice it. This could result in targetted traffic and this means a much better chance to make some sales.

It's never a mistake to send a real letter and a CD to the most important printed games mags in your country. Continue contacting reviewers of game sites to build up first personal connections.

Giving up in less time than it took to develop your game shouldn't be an option. You mastered many challenges to complete the game itself, selling and marketing just means a new set of challenges. A great "reward" for getting something done, eh?

[Jack Norton]

I never wanted to be rich of my first game, but I thought I can sell it in 100 copies at least. Currently it seems that I was way way wrong.

If you (or anyone else) think that selling 100 copies is "the minimum" for a first game, well...
I have games that sold way more than 100 copies the first month, others that didn't even reach that amount after 1 year.
My suggestion is to write another game. And in general avoid arcade games since are really hard to sell (too much competition from flash games).

[Executrix]

The bleak reality is that if you don't do market research before developing a game, you have a much lower chance of being able to sell it. We have had many prototypes that we have decided not to develop fully because they probably wouldn't sell very well, even though they are fun to us.

[nadam]

If you (or anyone else) think that selling 100 copies is "the minimum" for a first game, well...

Not the minimum, but it is a bit sad for me that if I washed dishes at McDonalds instead of programming this game, I could earn much-much more money.

I have games that sold way more than 100 copies the first month, others that didn't even reach that amount after 1 year.
My suggestion is to write another game. And in general avoid arcade games since are really hard to sell (too much competition from flash games).

I thought about flash competition, but I thought 3D graphics with real time soft shadows, real physics and A.I. will differentiate my game from primitive flash foosball games. But I was very naive about it, I admit.

[Mattias Gustavsson]

How much (if any) have you spent on advertising?

[nadam]

How much (if any) have you spent on advertising?

I have not spent anything on advertising. I've heard that conversion rate is so low for a typical game, that payed advertisements such as Adwords are not an option for a $10 game. What kind of advertisement do you guys suggest?