A YouTube for games?

[whisperstorm]

It seems lately that there have been efforts to create sites that have great community, easy uploading, comments, user-generated content, and easy sharing and embedding via flash. For example:
Images: Flickr.
Slides: Slideshare.
Video: YouTube.
Music: -- tons of sites (iTunes?)

However, there does not seem to be a "YouTube for games". Now I know there are portal sites, and there are even flash portal sites like miniclip, however they really are not quite the same. Why? Because there's no user-generated content. It's all created by game development teams. To me, a true "YouTube for games" would be a site that has the community, comments, etc. that I mentioned above but also had an extremely easy IDE or application to create games. These games would be most likely totally flash based, most of them completely inane yet strangely addicting for 10 minutes, and probably episodic to some extent (like lonelygirl66 or whatever she is on youtube).

There is no site like that as far as I know. It seems to me if someone with the wherewithall to create something like that - with all the "social software" of a Flickr plus this new thing that would be a very easy drag and drop game maker (probably also in flash) that you could import images, etc to and embed the result on any site that they would make a ton of money - at least in ads.

I asked this question on my own blog (http://www.andrewwooldridge.com/blog), and someone mentioned that there is a Vitalize plugin (http://download.clickteam.com/vitalize3/plugin.html)for Clickteam games - which I think is a possible contender for this "youtube for games" - however there is no accompanying site with all the ratings, sharing, etc. that flickr/youtube/etc. have.

RealArcade is another near miss - it has the community, and the ratings, etc. but not the ability for "anyone" to upload a game - nor "every game" to be playable/embeddable on myspace/blogs.

It seems to me this represents an incredible opportunity for someone willing to go down the road of creating a social website, tie it to a very easy to use game builder, and allow tagging/embedding/etc through flash. Imagine if a site like miniclip or bigfish had a decent game builder you could use to whip out a quick rpg or match-3 or something, and have an instant audience consuming new games every day just like folks do for youtube/flickr/ etc.

Anyone else's thoughts on this? Am I way off base? Does anyone know of a flash based game making tool? I'm seriously thinking about making something like this in a very basic way -- tools like Laszlo (http://openlaszlo.org)would make creating this IDE extremely easy - it would just be a matter of coming up with a generic game "markup" language or something. I dont have more than rudimentary PHP skills - but perhaps you are reading this and are thinking "this might be cool". If so, PM me - perhaps we could be the next
Chad and Steve (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCVxQ_3Ejkg&eurl=) :)

[Anthony Flack]

Well... sounds interesting at all, but it doesn't really fit the pattern of the other sites you mentioned. After all, youtube doesn't have video editing or animation software built in, and itunes doesn't have recording, mixing and sequencing software... they are all about accessing content that has already been created.

But apart from that, hey, could be fun.

[papillon]

... newgrounds?

[Indiepath]

Ok well I was not going to say anything until monday but since the topic is open already...

-----------------------------------------

A quick heads up on the latest project from Indiepath that is due for beta release on Monday...

#############################

Founded by Indiepath Ltd in August 2006, xxxx.com is community oriented website where people come to play and share video games. xxxx embraces the latest and greatest web technologies, enabling the diversity and scale of web game content never before seen. xxxx is the game site players dream of, for developers it's the launch platform they have always deserved.

What is xxxx?

xxxx is a video game website where the community controls the content by uploading, sharing, reviewing and playing the games. Video game developers are encouraged to upload and share their latest creations and have xxxx members give them creative and constructive feedback, and perhaps even purchase a copy or two. Where else can a developer try out new ideas, showcase their latest creation and get feedback within minutes of release. Virtually any game uploaded to xxxx.com be delivered as a web browser embedded game.

xxxx is for everyone, people can :

1. - Play the latest video games for free
2. - Find people with similar gaming interests
3. - Compete in challenges and score leagues
4. - Upload and share games worldwide for free
5. - Embed games on their own websites
6. - Create sub-communities or Gaming Groups of people who play the same games
7. - Earn loyalty points for playing games, rating games and providing constructive feedback.

####################################

For the developer you get :-

- igloader
- Advertising
- Hosting
- Communitiy networking
- Transactional API for microtransactions on premium titles
- Ability to add the webgame on your own site - and any other.

In addition :-

We want to help you sell more of your own games. In exchange for a small affiliate fee we will place direct download, website and purchase links on your game page - we'll even track the activity and produce reports for you to download and analyse.

Every penny of revenue earned from the affiliate program is credited straight back into your advertising account. You can use your advertising credit to purchase further ad-impressions.

We want you to decide what affiliate fees you pay to us, expermiment with economies of scale - it's your choice.

#################################

What's the deal?

We need content! More details for follow on Monday.

[whisperstorm]

0_o wow!

I agree that sites like youtube and flickr dont have creation tools - however there is no easy way to embed into flash all the various ways you can create a game. Perhaps a site more like widgetbox (http://www.widgetbox.com/)- which let's you embed flash/html/etc will be a possible contender. Cant wait to see what this igLoader site is...

The only problem with the igLoader is that you have to be on windows...(or is there a osx version?)

Newgrounds is very close, but does it allow anyone to upload a game? Does it allow anyone to embed the game into their own site?

[Sirrus]

Hows this any different from anything else though?
Even something like GameTrove?

[soniCron]

However, there does not seem to be a "YouTube for games". Kongregate (http://kongregate.com/) is launching soon, and they bill themselves as the YouTube of games.


Hows this any different from anything else though?
Even something like GameTrove? Fast turnaround, user submission of web games. ("Web," being the operative word.)

[Indiepath]

I am aware of Kongregate however their focus is Flash Games, our new site is for *any game* that can we wrapped and delivered using our plugin tech - and that includes games coded in flash.

One key point about our approach is the fact that anyone can embed any of the games in any webpage by simply adding a single line of code, for example : <script src="http://www.thedomain.com/play?0f5717ccfd46d8fc30eb6ade76cf5ddf"></script>

[soniCron]

I am aware of Kongregate however their focus is Flash Games, our new site is for *any game* that can we wrapped and delivered using our plugin tech - and that includes games coded in flash. And I applaud you for that, but you've got a lot of ground to cover to reach the kind of penetration Flash has. Even Java gaming sites aren't nearly as numerous as Flash sites for that simple reason.

Hope it works out for you! :)

[Indiepath]

And I applaud you for that, but you've got a lot of ground to cover to reach the kind of penetration Flash has. Even Java gaming sites aren't nearly as numerous as Flash sites for that simple reason.

Hope it works out for you! :)
Granted, but what is good is penetration when you have limited content, or content that has to be specifically crafted for the delivery mechanism; and since 99% of us don't code in flash I can't see our site struggling for content somehow. We can take virutally any game, or console emulator, and deliver it within the community environment, and there is a 20(ish) year back catalogue of games to choose from.

Now where is that C64 emulator I wrapped for igLoader? I can see a C64 channel coming along...

[KNau]

These communities already exist but they're based around specific tools. RPGMaker, Gamemaker, Click N Play etc all have community sites where people upload their games for free for others to play.

There are far more people willing and capable of creating audio and video content for free than those who would create games for free. Even free Flash sites have to spend money on sponsorships to make sure they have some passable quality content. You're fishing in a much, much, much smaller pond. That might be good or might be bad, time will tell.

The buzzword combo of "social networking" and "micro-transactions" just might be enough to get yourself swept up into the bubble though. Good luck, just remember to cash out as soon as you can.

[whisperstorm]

Yeah, it seems like for this to be successful it has to be extremely simple to upload games as well as have a delivery system that is fairly ubiquitous...

All the "pieces" are there - have been there for video for a while - but youtube made it stinking easy, as well as not forcing the user to download a plugin...

[Indiepath]

until monday......

[soniCron]

Granted, but what is good is penetration when you have limited content... We can take virutally any game, or console emulator, and deliver it within the community environment, and there is a 20(ish) year back catalogue of games to choose from. Now where is that C64 emulator I wrapped for igLoader? I can see a C64 channel coming along... Forgive me if I'm misinterpereting you, but you seem to be advocating copyright infringement, if not in a roundabout way. You lambast limited content and then talk about delivering console emulators in the same paragraph. Surely you don't mean commercial games? If not, then to what breadth of content for consoles are you referring?

[zoombapup]

Just a heads up... there is already something "in the works" along these lines.. cant talk about it, but its by a very well known indie engine provider.

I'm always happy to see more delivery points and "portals" that arent your traditional top 10 dealies.

For my own point of view, we're also setting something up with a few other devs for online only games (more of a service offering), but thats a ways off.

Nice to see people taking the initiative though! Indiepath! good luck!

[simonh]

A 'You Tube' for games will never work simply because good games are so rare.

99% of uploaded games will be terrible Pong/Pacman/Breakout/match 3 clones, while the remaining 1% that people want to play are already well exposed on the portals.

[soniCron]

*stunned* Have you never seen YouTube? ;)

[Indiepath]

Forgive me if I'm misinterpereting you, but you seem to be advocating copyright infringement, if not in a roundabout way. You lambast limited content and then talk about delivering console emulators in the same paragraph. Surely you don't mean commercial games? If not, then to what breadth of content for consoles are you referring?

Yes please forgive me I did not make in very clear. Indiepath already has agreements with a number of C64 authors to publish the games via the C64 emulator - this is a side line that can extend to this site if deemed appropriate. With regard to copyright infringement, this is a serious issue and one that will not be tolerated - games are not published as soon as they are uploaded as they are heavily scrutinised(ized) for adware, viruses and IP ownership. Coupled with the plugin sandbox we ensure that content is screened and suitable for download. I was trying to make a point about content and I apologise for the mixed message.

With regard to zoombapup's point that there is already something in the works with an "Engine Provider", I refer to my original point that is you will need to develop in that particular technology to take advantage of their offering.

Anyway, there is room for all of us but hey it's gonna be nice being the first to market - albiet with limited budgets and resources. I gotta get you guys using igLoader somehow :D

[soniCron]

Don't get me wrong. I'd love to see your "portal" succeed! But I think it'll be a long, uphill battle. Nevertheless, you can count on me to help anyway I can. You'll be accepting Flash games, too, right? :)

[Indiepath]

Don't get me wrong. I'd love to see your "portal" succeed! But I think it'll be a long, uphill battle. Nevertheless, you can count on me to help anyway I can. You'll be accepting Flash games, too, right? :)

A battle it may be :) The ideal would be for a major infrastucture partner to pick up the technology based on this deliverable - Hint Hint :) - And no I don't mean google - there is more to life than google and share certificates.

And yes flash games are welcome but you will need to compile as a .exe so that we may deliver the whole wrapper experience.

[MacMan45]

A battle it may be :) The ideal would be for a major infrastucture partner to pick up the technology based on this deliverable - Hint Hint :)

If you would be hoping for a google buyout, you would be disapointed.

Google's mission is to organize the world's information and make it universally accessible and useful.

If i remember correctly igLoader lets win32 executables (& hence directx based games) to run inside a browser.
Nothing universally accessible about that.

An uphill battle indeed.

[zoombapup]

Indiepath: nope, the site I alluded to isnt tied to any particular engine. Its actually a search based game submission and ranking site. Pretty much modelled on youtube/myspace from what I gather.

I'll put all our singleplayer stuff on anything I feel adds value to our products, so I'm happy to have more people *that is people I trust and care to work with* available to sell through.

At the end of the day, downloadable games dont always equate to "casual" and its about time we taught people that.

[whisperstorm]

This is all very exciting! It's almost as if a web-based "console wars" is starting, only the console is a browser and the games will probably run on both/all. Imagine if these websites went a bit further and provided some apis for things like multiplayer (ala bunchball (http://www.bunchball.com/)).

And I agree that alot of indiegames are not that great a quality, but that seems to be the case with YouTube videos as well. The cool thing about YouTube is that maybe 1% of the content there is interesting to any given 1% of the audience, but the viral thing is that it's not the same 1% for everyone, Everything on there is interesting to 'someone' and that huge dispersion of audience makes 'everyone' want to visit the site.

Plus I think its too easy to have a very narrow view of what is a 'game' - to some it could just be an interactive slideshow, or a pop the bubble wrap kinda thing - all the way up to a complicated rpg. The point will be to create a website that 'everyone' would go to play 'some' kind of game. There will probably be tons of solitare/card games - match-3's - retro arcade games - etc. However there willl eventually be 'someone' who creates a killer game that actually takes advantage of the 'webness' of the medium there and become very popular - so you will begin to establish a bit of celebrity like there is on youtube and flickr.

Can't wait till monday :)

[jeb_]

Maybe you should take a look at http://www.create-games.com/ ? All the games there are made by users, and most of them can be played in a browser with the Vitalize plugin.

[LilGames]

Oh god, a "Youtube" for games would mean death to indies (unless you enjoy making your games for FREE ).

[soniCron]

Sure. Just like YouTube means the death of the film industry. :rolleyes:

[KNau]

YouTube is a great way to keep wannabes from trying to actually sell their amateur crap.

There was (is) a big problem of shot-on-video garbage packed in DVD cases posing as actual films. Places like YouTube may be easing some of the pressure on the indie film scene by letting those who aren't serious about it chase their 15 seconds of fame rather than money.

A YouTube for games might help ease some of the market overcrowding by giving away most of the half-finished breakout and match-3 clones, rather than trying to collect $19.95 each for them.

[Dan MacDonald]

What's the deal?

We need content! More details for follow on Monday.


Spill the beans.. it's monday! :)

[Indiepath]

http://forums.indiegamer.com/showthread.php?t=8738

Maybe you saw that already :)

[jimgreer]

Hey guys - if you want more info on Kongregate, check out this thread:

http://forums.indiegamer.com/showthread.php?t=8773

We really don't want to be seen as the place to upload your crappy games for free. In fact we're creating a one-click payment system so that developers can charge for premium content in their games. A lot like Microsoft Points, but we'll take a much smaller percentage than they do. We're also sharing ad revenue with developers.

Of course we just started in June so we don't have ads or payments yet - for now we're just having development contests with cash prizes. But we're working hard to make sure that the best developers have several ways to make money from their hard work!

[Indiepath]

Who decides that a game is crappy? Let the public decide for a change and not the disti :)

Just my opinion..

[jimgreer]

Yup, that's how it works - games make it to the homepage based on their rating/popularity. Also if you rate games we'll make personalized recommendations to you - you might have different tastes than the mass audience.