View Full Version : Quest for the bedroom programmers (BBC News)
puggy
10-14-2006, 06:04 AM
There's a nice article on the bbc news site, some people might find interesting.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/click_online/6047566.stm
cliffski
10-14-2006, 06:25 AM
One of these days I'm going to slam my fist straight into that idiot molyneuxs face. He has been talking this crap for years, and its purely 100% because he tries to stop all the talented people he has working from him from going off and starting their own companies.
Demis left and started his own
The ragdoll kung fu guys left
I left
And I know a bunch of others who have left. In every case, I know they are happy to escape.
God he winds me up.
Anthony Flack
10-14-2006, 06:38 AM
Yeah, that was an irritating paragraph. He also failed to mentioned that his "amateurish" early efforts were far more positively received, and fondly remembered, than more recent games (such as the aforementioned Black and White or The Movies). Despite having muscles in the faces.
He also didn't mention that a top quality two-man independent effort actually stands a chance of making far better money for its developers today than back in the 80s.
Anyway, to answer the rhetorical question posed by the article:
It is still early days for Microsoft, but if it succeeds in creating a community of bedroom console developers, can you imagine what the next generation of games could be like?
Most likely no different at all.
electronicStar
10-14-2006, 03:14 PM
He's really reached a serious stage of the bloated head syndrome.
He deserves a pie in the face:p
One of these days I'm going to slam my fist straight into that idiot molyneuxs face. He has been talking this crap for years, and its purely 100% because he tries to stop all the talented people he has working from him from going off and starting their own companies.
Demis left and started his own
The ragdoll kung fu guys left
I left
And I know a bunch of others who have left. In every case, I know they are happy to escape.
God he winds me up.
zoombapup
10-14-2006, 03:29 PM
Hehehe.. my dislike of PM has been around for a LOOONG time. I just got so sick of his "talking head" being the only one we ever got for a developer comment on ANYTHING in the UK.
Of course, it could be because he had a PR company. But.. I dunno, someone acting as "the face of british development" always irked me. That and his habit of sounding as though HE made all of the bullfrog and lionhead games personally.
Of course, a few others have stepped into the PR machine, Charles Cecil and Ian Livingstone dont do so badly these days either, considering none of them actually produces a goddam thing these days its pretty funny.
Clearly, he hasnt gotten a goddam clue what possibilities there are in games outside of the AAA treadmill, but I dont really care, he means nothing to me and I obviously mean the same to him.
What annoys me in all this, is that "the games industry" is far more likely to be portrayed by him rather than some smaller developer, like the moonpod guys, introversion or cliffy. I mean, what exactly IS "the industry" anyway? Like its some private freakin club??
Actually, if you work in the AAA realm, it kind of is a club. Just go out for a beer with a few of the creative directors in the UK industry to see that. Its like incest.
I'm more than glad to leave all that crap behind. Hell, I might even produce a populous like game someday just for kicks.
HairyTroll
10-14-2006, 09:07 PM
move along, move along.
puggy
10-15-2006, 06:45 AM
One of these days I'm going to slam my fist straight into that idiot molyneuxs face. He has been talking this crap for years, and its purely 100% because he tries to stop all the talented people he has working from him from going off and starting their own companies.
Demis left and started his own
The ragdoll kung fu guys left
I left
And I know a bunch of others who have left. In every case, I know they are happy to escape.
God he winds me up.
Also the fact he dosn't realise much about the indie sector as he's had his head up the cloulds for soo long.
There's some nice game creation tools being developed out there. For example Realmcrafter is a very good MMORPG engine and once v2 is out (changing 3d engine from blitz to custom) it could rivial some of the custom made games out there.
Of course what people like me need is a tool that will automatically make top quality 3d models, fully textured with little fuss, though thats unlikly.
Now the big question everyone wants to know though is what cliff's next big game will be? :P
papillon
10-15-2006, 08:41 AM
He realises there are indies out there, but if he points the reporters in our direction HE won't get as much attention! :)
Dan MacDonald
10-15-2006, 02:08 PM
Epic's Gears of War was made by a team that scaled up to 50 members at it's peek but typcially ran with about 35. I have a feeling it's going to be a lot more profitable (and even more popular) then PM's recent game design outings. (referring to PM's quote that it takes 150 people to make a game)
The one thing I'd like to give PM credit for is Syndicate, one of my favorite games growing up. It was a little rough around the edges but it was really good in a lot of ways. Though I started doubting PM later when Syndicate Wars sucked and I couldn't be bothered to buy and of the games after that. Dungeon keeper was about the last title he made that I had any real interest in. (not enough to buy it however). In retrospect I think that syndicate might have been acidentally good. :)
Applewood
10-15-2006, 02:44 PM
Having met them both, I've always been of the opinion that it was PM doing all the talking and Glenn Corpes doing all the programming.
Were you about then cliff ? I've totally lost track of Glenn - he was a cool guy.
zoombapup
10-15-2006, 03:45 PM
Doesnt Glen work for microsoft now? or some such technology vendor. I seem to recall seeing his name a few GDC's ago on a techy thread somewhere. Might have been ATI/NVIDIA too.
Ah syndicate... and hell, populous was ok too, at least conceptually.
Applewood
10-15-2006, 04:15 PM
Populous was the dogs knob imo. Loved it. Pop2 was ok. Pop3 blew chunks
filharvey
10-16-2006, 07:45 AM
Glenn is still around. When I was at bullfrog, glenn was usually programming the graphics engines. Think Magic carpet etc... Peter was then programming Theme Park, Not sure how it went after that, as I left for virgin.
But Glenn as I said is still around. Was at climax a couple of years ago.
Phil
soniCron
10-16-2006, 08:33 AM
For all you Molyneux bashers: A new article on Gamasutra about Lionhead (http://www.gamasutra.com/features/20061016/carless_01.shtml).
cliffski
10-16-2006, 09:28 AM
grrrrr. I wrote a long post, but I'm going to be more professional, and just get back to my own work.
grrrrr.
soniCron
10-31-2006, 07:58 AM
Aaaaand... even more Molyneux fodder at Gamasutra for all you haters:
http://www.gamasutra.com/features/20061031/carless_01.shtml
The place I came from was when I was always a failure. When I was at school, I was just an idiot. And everyone thought I was an idiot, and everyone would always say that I would never do anything or get anywhere. And because of that, I feel I’ve yet to do that game which really makes a difference – that really is the landmark game.
That means that I do push myself – I can look you in the eye and truly say that I’m trying to make Fable 2 the greatest game I will ever build. If you write that, it will get me in an enormous amount of trouble, but that is what I truly believe.
I haven't got anything against the guy, but I know a few of you do... :p
Hey, if the pinacle of gaming is the 3D combat rpg platformer, then sure, why not. But that's short sighted as far as I see it.
cliffski
10-31-2006, 09:52 AM
"I’ll be absolutely honest with you, sometimes in the past I’ve actually changed little bits of the game to match the misquote, however insane that sounds."
Yup. That added a whole years development to the game I worked on, and made most of us want to leave. Great plan.
"If you don’t have a really strong businessperson on your team then it can be a serious problem"
Their biz dev guy once told me "Theres no real future in online distrubution methods such as steam." In fact he said it in front of the whole company.
Peter still can't come to grips with the concept of an indie developer who self publishes yet.
ho hum.
Peter still can't come to grips with the concept of an indie developer who self publishes yet.
It's probably for the best. Besides, how else can he stop talent from running away and starting their own companies, except by denying their very existance. At least George Lucas has admitted the big budget movies model is on it's way out.
Who knew being a self-important crank could get you so much press? And here I've been giving away my misinformed, bad-attitude for free!
Moose2000
11-01-2006, 02:45 AM
Yup. That added a whole years development to the game I worked on, and made most of us want to leave. Great plan.
Be fair Cliff - when he did that, he guaranteed that the changes would bring an extra five million sales. It's just good business sense.
Davaris
11-01-2006, 03:09 AM
I don't know why you're getting so mad Cliff. As long as the AAAs keep making games on that scale, they are going to be risk adverse and are not going to compete with people like you. :)
cliffski
11-01-2006, 04:13 AM
this is true :D
Anthony Flack
11-01-2006, 04:14 AM
I think Peter Molyneux may be too wacko to be risk-adverse. He certainly doesn't seem to mind making games that come out all wrong.
I liked this:
"Yes, there's World of Warcraft, and it's fantastic. I sat in my underpants until four in the morning playing that game for about six months and I realised I was one of the millions of people doing that." - PM
Big P playing games in his trolleys. That's a truly disquieting thought :)
vBulletin v3.6.0, Copyright ©2000-2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.