ann: phoenicas release

[aristid]

hello everyone.

phoenicas, an arcade 2d shooter is soft-released. :D

screenshots:
pic1 (http://www.phoenicas.com/phoenicas/phoenicas2.jpg)
pic2 (http://www.phoenicas.com/phoenicas/phoenicas1.jpg)
pic3 (http://www.phoenicas.com/phoenicas/phoenicas3.jpg)

main site, with info, screenshots, instructions, online highscore tables etc is here:
http://www.phoenicas.com/ (http://www.phoenicas.com)

direct demo download: (16.5mb) here (http://www.phoenicas.com/phoenicas/phoenicas_demo.exe)

requirements: winXP, directx9.0c, descent 3d card, p4-class processor

any feedback is greatly appreciated.
thanks,
aristides.
www.mytaras.com (http://www.mytaras.com)

[Nexic]

I'll take a look at this new version and let you know what I think again, but I'm guessing it still going to be a bit on the hard side ^.^

[aristid]

thanks, liks are now fixed.

the only change is what I described in my email. when in easy mode, and player is not carrying weapons, the first wave goes easy on the poor player.
this only happens to beginners though, because,
as all seasoned phoenicas players know :p , at the beginning, stick to the right, kill all 5 same-type aliens, collect reward, then remain to the right, and kill another 5 same-type aliens (they'll come to you, dont go to them) , collect reward, and there you have it, weapon type-2 upgrade to blast through the first wave! :eek:

I dont think it's insanely hard, it just not super-easy!

[Nexic]

Ah damn, I can't really take a look as the demo has expired.

Really I think a play time demo is much better than a 'time installed on hard drive demo'. The later means that the demo will expire, even if they haven't gotten around to playing it yet. It also means that someone who plays it solidly can complete it within the day and then not buy it.

[Nexic]

Yeh I don't think it's that hard, if you know the exact sequence to get through the level ^.^ (which I didn't)

[aristid]

Really I think a play time demo is much better than a 'time installed on hard drive demo'. The later means that the demo will expire, even if they haven't gotten around to playing it yet. It also means that someone who plays it solidly can complete it within the day and then not buy it.

I always thought it was a 'time running, whether you're looking at the title-screen or playing demo'. I am pretty sure it's not 'time installed in hard drive'. will check it out though. I am using armadillo and 'exipre by minutes' if anyone is familiar...

[Nexic]

Yeh I use Armadillo every so often. Are you saying you have set expire by minutes to 24:00:00? I definitely didn't play for 24 hours, maybe 20 minutes at most. Maybe you meant to set hours but accidentally set minutes or something? So you put: 00:24:00?

Maybe you have also accidentally set number of uses?

Are you sure you havent set:
Expire after X days after key entered (or first run on default)?

[aristid]

major mistake on my part!

I entered 90 (meaning minutes), and the program translated this to 1:30 (which looked fine to me - as I thought it was 1hr30mins).
it was actually 1min30secs. since I have not enabled nuke (my program has a second measure, it wont let you run over 90min), you might as well have played for 10mins, but when you tried to run again, your 1min30seconds would be over...

terribly sorry about this, I am uploading the corrected demo 1hr30min limited as I type this (should be up in 15mins - not seconds!)

whoever has downloaded the first edition and wants to give it another try, please download the new edition.

thank you nexic for taking the time with this...

aristides.

[Kestral]

Your tutorial is very complete. The soft piano music in the background of the tutorial was a nice touch.

Overall the game feels very polished. The only artistic quirk I saw was the dark edges on the explosion graphics. If you use the alpha channel you could make the explosions look nicer.

[svero]

Well.. I had a lot of fun playing this. You really got all the little shootery kind of details right. Subtlety like the slowing shots and so on. I love the weapons powerups. I like a lot about this. What I didnt much care for was the throwback to the 80's graphics, the UI, and the music. Im not a big fan of the presentation overall, but its not that bad. Gameplay wise it's quite tough, but for my part I like that. I dont know how easy to market this will be.. im guessing quite hard. But for hardcore shooter fans such as myself its a breath of fresh air.

[aristid]

@Kestral:
thank you for your kind words.
I have been seeing the explosions for a year, I grew accustomed to them! I just fixed them, feathered a bit on the outside so as not to have the rough edges. Works better on larger scale, smaller ones kind of look the same, but I think it's a big improvement.
thanks for noticing this!
fixed demo is up.

@svero
had a lot of fun creating those dynamic details that I'm very glad you noticed!
80s seems to be well imprinted in my subconsious (ouch), will try to push it away in the future... Didnt want to follow the entire rulebook on casual games, I'm a shooter fan myself and wanted to make something I'd like to play (and I do). we'll see how marketing goes. I'm seeing half-full right now. Thanks for your comments, "breath of fresh air" is very polite.

[svero]

Didnt want to follow the entire rulebook on casual games, I'm a shooter fan myself and wanted to make something I'd like to play

Yes.. Well this is very clearly not a casual game in any sense of the word. Which is fine. Its fun for me as a shooter so Im happy. Im just not sure how easy it will be to sell... I think the players are out there. Its just very hard to reach them.

[aristid]

I dont think pompom's space tripper was casual in today's sense (or any other sense), so there's a case of a hardcore shooter reaching its audience. I enjoyed that title immensely. I think (seeing from myself) shooter fans cant really find what they're looking for in todays 'casual' system, but its the same with music, theater, cinema, dance etc. it's the way things are.

ot:
you mention doumas in your sig, I did a contemporary dance show (the music) on lady of the camelias a few years back, had a great time, toured in france etc.
video clip is here,
http://www.mytaras.com/videos/woman_in_white.wmv
(I'm the bald guy playing the synth!)
some music is here,
http://www.mytaras.com/music.html

:cool:

[svero]

Dumas is one of my favorite authors. His stuff is a lot of fun...

As to phoenicus.. I dont know if pompom was ever really happy with their sales though you know. I agree space tripper rocked. That doesnt necessarily mean it sold like bejewled. Not that one needs to sell hundreds of thousands of copies to be happy though.

The more I play the game the more impressed I am with the subtlety of gameplay you guys introduced. But at the same time the more Im cursing you for screwing up certain basic things. Like.. here I am.. I enjoy the game, I work hard to make it through level one and then the game ends. Now is that demo only? Probably.. How many levels are there? NO idea! Let me just turn off music. Oops.. no setting.. And so on. You really should tidy up all that sort of thing. The game itself is pretty solid and fun as hardcore shooters go. The UI and in game marketing is weak.

- S

[NuriumGames]

Just downloaded and getting an error:

'Runtime Error 302 - Sprite does not exist at line 2726'

[aristid]

@NuriumGames:
this is the problem of working with darkbasic. it is fun, but has all these quirks! over which I have no control over. its definitely not a bug-free environment.
on the other hand if it wasnt for darkbasic, the game wouldnt be here, so I'm greatful for that part..
All I can say is, do you have directx9.0c? latest drivers? winxp? what processor? enough ram and videoram?
the call at line 2726 is to the main sprite, which definitely exists, there's definitely no bug there, something is probably not comatible with your setup.
this has happened twice by now (inexplicable errors) - to you and a friend - and is not nice at all.
if you can, please share your setup.
thanks in advance.

@svero:
when the program loads, it says it is a demo, and that it features the first level. there is a nintendo-type unlocking system. Some of the levels, like level 1, are tightly choreographed to the music, that's why I never considered turning it off. When I do turn it off, the experience becomes blander. I feel the music is an integral part of the game, not background. I am not sure whether I should have an 'off' option, I dont have one on purpose though.

[svero]

@svero:
when the program loads, it says it is a demo, and that it features the first level. there is a nintendo-type unlocking system. Some of the levels, like level 1, are tightly choreographed to the music, that's why I never considered turning it off. When I do turn it off, the experience becomes blander. I feel the music is an integral part of the game, not background. I am not sure whether I should have an 'off' option, I dont have one on purpose though.

Well.. it's not at all clear what you get, how many levels there are, whats in the demo vs the full version etc... It will hurt sales. Imagine going to a store with your credit card and buying an unmarked paper bag with some random product in it that they claim is similar to another product you liked once, but they wont tell you exactly what it is. That's your current marketing strategy. How many of those bags would you buy? You're not selling the demo. They've already got/played that. You're selling the other stuff they get thats not already in the demo. Thats what you have to make clear. Its not sufficient to say somewhere in text that its a 1 level demo. Most of the time people dont read that stuff anyway.. its just click click click let me play.

As to the sound.. well i often play games while streaming radio. So I like to turn the sound off or set it low. For me a volume slider is important. I think if you try to force your preferred mode of play on other players you'll end up limiting sales. Id say let err on the side of letting players do what they want settings wise even if you feel the music is a key ingredient. If players really like the music well they'll leave it on. If they dont but they love everything else why prevent them from enjoying what they like?

[NuriumGames]

Nothing is bug free :)

'directx9.0c? latest drivers? winxp? what processor? enough ram and videoram?'

WinXP SP2
More than enought RAM (sure)
Videoram: 128 MB (RADEON 9200 SE AGP), latest drivers.
CPU: AMD Athlon XP 2100+
DirectX: DirectX 9.0c

Hope you can find what is happening.

[aristid]

@svero:
points taken.
I have uploaded a new version, music can now be turned on-off, also it is made cleared what's on offer for the final version. when a user finishes the demo level, a screen appears that links, if needed, to the website and lists what's gained by getting the full version.
thanks for helping out, much appreciated! :)

@nurium
sadly, I cant think of anything that would help. I have posted a question to darkbasic forums and the developers, but doubt anything will come out of it. I will keep looking into it.
breakquest is beautiful, congratulations!

the updated demo will reset its timer, so anyone that wants to have a second go, be my guests!

[svero]

Its actually a really good game. You guys did a great job on the gameplay itself. The attack patterns, the alien behaviour, the way shots work etc.. all very good.(for a real hardcore shooter crowd) It's all in the little details. Shoot off one wing the other beats faster and the bird flies slower and so on. I love that stuff. I may just have to pick this one up.

[aristid]

thank you very much.

after succumbing to nexic's silent pressuring techniques, I have made the ship go faster by almost 50%. although I was used to the previous speed and after a lot of playtesting, it seems the urgency this gives to the gameplay is positive, so it's in.

new demo is up,
and the demo's timer is reset, so you get 60 minutes more.

thanks,
aristides

[Nexic]

Excellent!

It's much better now, I even managed to make it past the first level! Really this is a brilliant game, and I'm so glad you made that small change. It really makes it soooo much more fun (for me at least).

Though when I went to post my score, the online highscores flashed up for about 2 seconds and then I got another error saying someting about a missing sprite. This is why you should use Blitz3D and not DB :p

[Rubs]

I liked the screenshots, but when I downloaded, installed and ran the game, it hung my PC during loading. There was some white text - "LOADING - PLEASE WAIT" in the middle of the screen and some "Initializing..., 64, Thinking" grey text in the top left corner. When nothing happened for about 20-30 seconds, I thought switching apps or calling task manager, but nothing worked, the game took all resources. I waited a bit more and when I was going to press the "reset" buttons (pronouncing not very pollite words in my mind :)) the game suddenly exited (thanks to God!) and I didn't risk running it the second time. Maybe will try later when I don't have so many applications loaded.

Athlon XP 2500+, 1.5 gig ram, GeForce MX440, a keyboard and a mouse :)

Tell me if I can give you some more info to help you with this issue. I'd like to see the game in action. Will try it on my home pc today as well.

[svero]

Though when I went to post my score, the online highscores flashed up for about 2 seconds and then I got another error saying someting about a missing sprite. This is why you should use Blitz3D and not DB :p

Yeah I have to say I took notice of all these hardware problems. I've been getting the impression blitz is much more stable.

[aristid]

This is why you should use Blitz3D and not DB :p
I know. if you remember a demo in the first edition of blitz, aristoids, that was me. I have been waiting for the blitzmax 3d module (as everyone). tested the demo of blitzmax and its brilliant.
I have ran into so many problems with db its not even funny.
but, yesterday I made the protoype engine for what will probably be my next game in 2 hours and it absolutely rocks. between a rock and a hard place is where I am.
I'd love to go with blitzmax, but I need 3d from now on.

@rubs:
I am sorry this happened for you. the program does take over all resources, but just let it load up. it can take some time on a slower machine. I am guessing it will work fine for you. let me know please.

cheers.

[Nexic]

Well I use Blitz3D, that can do 3D ^.^ I've used both DB and Blitz3D a lot, and I know for sure that B3D is far better.

See my reply to this thread:
http://www.shmup-dev.com/index.php?topic=423.msg3535#new

[Rubs]

I managed to launch the game Ok at my home PC which is Athlon64 3000+, 1GB RAM, ATI X600PRO.

PROS:
- I liked detailed and polished graphics. Nice work!
- Piano music and separate note sounds are awesome! Liked that a lot!
- Overall the game looks solid and well-designed.

CONS:
- Sound effects' levels in menu seemed unbalanced. There where some loud shot-like sounds which I disliked. They could be much softer. I met loud sounds in few other places, so it makes sense to balance sound levels.
- Title screen always showing after the game. Isn't it enough seeing it once when the game is launched? Why should I look at it so many times? :)
- The game is indeed pretty difficult. When I started the game (with easy mode turned on), I first collected 3500 points, then 14700, then 22900, then 13400, then 27400. Then I went through tutorial :) And at last passed first level with 32500 points. And that's with easy mode turned on!!! I didn't even look wat was the hard level :).
- A bug: when I went to options/controls and chose controller: joystick (I don't have one, just pressed for curiosity) the game hung. After I killed it (again with difficulty) with task manager, I saw some message box flicker with I gues "- pure virtual call" written in it.

My opinion is that the game needs further testing/polishing with major accent on difficulty levels ballancing.

[aristid]

thank you for testing it out.

re:PROS
thanks, glad you liked those bits!

re:CONS
- Sound effects' levels in menu seemed unbalanced.
the shot sounds are sfx for the sparks in the menus. I get mixed reviews for the sparks. never occured to me they were too loud, I will take a closer look. hopefully no other effects were unbalanced.
- Title screen always showing after the game.
dont really consider this to be a problem myself, but if it annoys people no problem taking out out of there..!
- A bug: joystick related hang.
thanks for this, I will look into it.

- The game is indeed pretty difficult. When I started the game (with easy mode turned on), I first collected 3500 points, then 14700, then 22900, then 13400, then 27400. Then I went through tutorial And at last passed first level with 32500 points. And that's with easy mode turned on!!! I didn't even look wat was the hard level .

I think you did pretty well! A player is not meant to go through the first level on the first try. And after a player does reach the end of part 1, they are meant to improve their scores. When we go for highscores, we reach about 55000 for part 1 and most of the times end our games at part 2 or 3. I always enjoyed this 'classic' approach. think ms.pacman. A newbie may well lose all 3 lives on level 1. A good player will need to pass level 1 with 12500 (or something similar - dont remember exactly - a perfect score) to have any chance going for a good score (along the lines of 80000, since we're mortals)
I am trying to understand this type of altitude towards difficulty.
perhaps people are used to go through 3-4 levels before they lose their first life. I personally dont like that, I get bored. I play an arcade game to get some action and challenge, and this is what I intended to deliver with phoenicas. Maybe its too much 'old-school' and not enough 'casual'. but 'old-school' is my school (thats a good slogan actually).
If the game is unfair in any way, I will definitely look into it though.
Tough but fair. (another slogan)

thanks for your input, I appreciate it.

[Rubs]

About difficulty. I think you need to add some control of the difficulty level. If you have this "easy mode" then at least make it easy for the vast majority of players. Making the game too hard may result in loss of interest and thus reduce sales. On the other hand, that's only my opinion :).