San Diego, Santa Barbara, LA game dev moving advice?

[C.S.Brewer]

I'd like to move to Thailand and live the cheap life....but my wife's family lives in the Los Angeles area and we are thinking about moving down there from Redwood City (near San Francisco) to be closer to them.

I'm still working fulltime on my game, but my practical side wants some other game company/ graphics jobs nearby. I love the San Francisco Bay Area and would like something with a similar, relatively laid back feel(If I can call the bay area laid back).

Do you folks have any advice on good areas to live in any of these towns?

Santa Barbara was really nice, but housing prices were crappily high, and It didn't seem like there were very many graphics/game jobs around (from the little bit of looking I've done)

We went down to San Diego last week and checked out the area (missed the San Diego meetup by a day). Rentals and housing seemed much more reasonable, but I don't know the area very well.

I've heard Long Beach is cool too.

any nice hidden neighborhoods I should check out? any other good southern California spots I'm missing?

thanks for any advice
-Clint

[Jim Buck]

I live in the Gaslamp part of downtown San Diego, and it's expensive as hell to rent/own down here. Other areas fare a bit better. I used to live in UTC and really loved it there (especially when compared to downtown noisiness - I'm a couple blocks from the ballpark). Pacific Beach could be ok/fun. La Jolla is expensive as hell, probably moreso than downtown. Santee is another semi-ok area you could look into. If you are willing to go a bit further north, Del Mar is pretty nice, but depending on specifically where you live there, it could also be a little expensive. Or, you could go east and get real cheap areas like El Cajon (maybe even La Mesa).

When you were down here, what areas did you check out?

As for jobs, there are a ton of companies here. However, one of SCEA's studios was closed down recently, so there is a whole batch of programmers and artists currently looking for jobs, many being unsuccessful. If you have superb skills, though, you could potentially squeeze in. Some of the bigger studios here: SCEA, SOE, RockStar, Midway, and THQ(Concrete Games studio). And there are a bunch of smaller companies like Bottle Rocket Studios and Sigil Games.

[robleong]

I did just the opposite and moved from San Diego to Redwood Shores in the bay area two months ago.

Jim (Buck) will probably be able to tell you about the jobs in the San Diego region, but I think there are quite a number of them.

As for where to live in the San Diego region, I was living in Carmel Valley and that's a pleasant suburban area to live in. I found houses in San Diego were only slightly less expensive than in the bay area, but you do get to buy newer properties. As for rentals, they're upwards of $1000 per month in Carmel Valley for a 2-bedroom apartment. UTC is another good place to live (it's near UCSD), but I think rentals there are even more expensive. Mission Valley is close to some good shopping centers and is closer to the city, and is slightly cheaper. Then there are all the beach areas if you're into sun, sand, and sea. Downtown and the Gaslamp district are pretty expensive, and the properties are smaller. Carlsbad which is slightly north of San Diego isn't a bad place to live either. Generally, don't live in the south of the city, as the areas get rougher the closer they get to the Mexican border.

Guess it all depends on what facilities you're looking for, and what the price range is. Good luck.

[robleong]

Hey Jim, you beat me to it! How's Gaslamp City Square? Have they completed phase II yet? That's great city living, you lucky one! :)

[C.S.Brewer]

Thanks for all the info guys...
Jim Buck: When you were down here, what areas did you check out?
It was a crazy few days of driving, I don't remember all the places, but we looked at
Carlsbad, Leucadia, Encinitas, Mission / Pacific / Ocean Beaches, La Jolla, Del Mar, Old Town, Poway, Chula Vista, National City, Clairmont, Banker's Hill...and drove through a bunch of other areas I don't remember the names of. We drove by Gas Lamp but didn't look around much...most of these places were just driving through checking out the feel of the area. We both liked Encinitas and the PB/LaJolla areas. I wish we had time to run around on all those rocks up at Rock Haven.

I'm a dirty hippy without a car, so public transportation is important, I had discounted Encinitas as being too far from work in SD, but it looks like the train is plenty fast, just like going from Redwood City to San Jose here.

Thanks for the game company references.

robleong: I did just the opposite and moved from San Diego to Redwood Shores in the bay area two months ago. Welcome to the neighborhood! and thanks for the info.

-clint

[Jim Buck]

C.S.Brewer: How much are you looking to spend per month on rental, assuming you want to rent?

robleong: Phase 2 has the framework up but still no internal or external walls. I think move-ins will be for later this year and early next year. As for how I like it, I realized during the past couple months that I am getting increasingly agitated living here. The crazy drunken noise goes very late into the night (past 3am sometimes), especially on ball game nights, and loud construction on projects very close to here (as close as a block away) begins before 8am, sometimes 6:30-7am. So, the quiet block of time for sleeping isn't as long as I'd like. The unfortunate part is that, though closed windows amazingly keep the noise to almost nil, the sun hits the windows in the early morning (even with curtains closed), getting it toasty in here very quickly.. so, we *have* to usually keep the windows open all night, thus letting all the noise in. I'm just biding my time until the 2 year mark. :) (It doesn't help that I now also work from my place, so I get all the daytime noise as well.. and the market is not really increasing down here, so I can't even say that it's all that worth it from an investment perspective.)

[robleong]

Clint, there's also High Moon Studios based in Carlsbad. I used to work in Carlsbad, and it is quite a classy, upper-middle class district. Many of my fellow workers live in Encinitas which is quite a pleasant area too.

Jim, thanks for the frank info about living in the Gaslamp City Square. As I must have told you, we were actually considering buying a place there at one stage, until we decided to move up to the bay area. The noise, I suppose, is part and parcel of city living! However, have you considered putting an A/C unit in your bedroom so you can shut out the noise, if that's a problem?

[merovingian]

Until a year ago, I used to live in the Burbank/Glendale area. I loved it. Houses there are astronomical, but no worse than the Bay Area, and in fact, a bit cheaper IMO.

Rents are rents. A huge 3 BR apartment in a nice neighborhood is $1500/month or so.

Nice quiet area. Lots of shopping and good cheap eats abound. And easy access to the Burbank airport if you like to travel.

[C.S.Brewer]

How much are you looking to spend per month on rental, assuming you want to rent?

Oh well you know, as little as possible! I've been living in high priced areas the past few years Santa Cruz and San Francisco, so I'm used to spending too much money. I'm hoping for something around 1300 and below, but we'd also like to rent a house (or at least a place with a shared yard) and are pretty flexible, from a few quick searches on craigslist it looks like there's 2 bedroom places around that price.

there's also High Moon Studios based in Carlsbad. I used to work in Carlsbad, and it is quite a classy, upper-middle class district. Many of my fellow workers live in Encinitas which is quite a pleasant area too.

Sounds like San Diego area is swimming in the games work, that's good news. Glad to hear Encinitas is nice, it seemed it but you never can tell just driving through and stopping for lunch a couple times.

[C.S.Brewer]

Until a year ago, I used to live in the Burbank/Glendale area.
we didn't think to look there. My father in law lives right over in the Van Nuys area. have to check that out next time we are down there.

-clint

[merovingian]

we didn't think to look there. My father in law lives right over in the Van Nuys area. have to check that out next time we are down there.

-clint

If you need to save money, there's Valley View and Monterey Park. Another angle to consider is the rampant real estate speculation going on there. There are a lot of investors that need to pay the mortgage on their newly acquired "rentals." So you might find a good deal on renting a house.

Rents in the bay area were astronomical during the dotcom boom. They've gone down quite a bit relatively since then. I suspect the same forces are starting to hit SoCal at this point.

Where did you live in Santa Cruz? I've been in Soquel the past year or so.

[C.S.Brewer]

Where did you live in Santa Cruz? I've been in Soquel the past year or so.
All over, I lived there for about 8 years, and probably lived in 10 different places, but mostly around downtown and westside, with a short stay over on 14th avenue. Lived in that huge white house right by the Poet and Patriot downtown for a while which was a nice location. I liked biking over at Nisene Marks in Soquel area very beautiful.

[Jim Buck]

However, have you considered putting an A/C unit in your bedroom so you can shut out the noise, if that's a problem?

We have an A/C but haven't yet used it. Ideally, we'd like to avoid using it to keep our expenses down (now that I quit my full-time job :) ), but worst case, it's an idea to try to manage the noise.

Btw, I think you made the right move by going to the Bay area - it's much nicer than San Diego.

[Jim Buck]

Oh well you know, as little as possible! I've been living in high priced areas the past few years Santa Cruz and San Francisco, so I'm used to spending too much money. I'm hoping for something around 1300 and below, but we'd also like to rent a house (or at least a place with a shared yard) and are pretty flexible, from a few quick searches on craigslist it looks like there's 2 bedroom places around that price.

Whoa, what area had 2-bedroom houses for ~$1300?? Last year, we were paying almost that much for a small 1-bedroom *apartment* in the UTC area. Downtown 1-bedroom apartments start at 1800-ish. Clairemont could be a rather cheap, but central, location to look into. It's a suburbian area.. when I moved here in '96, I was paying $690 for a 2-bedroom there, however I am sure they are much more than that now.

[C.S.Brewer]

Whoa, what area had 2-bedroom houses for ~$1300??

here's a craigslist search (http://sandiego.craigslist.org/cgi-bin/search?areaID=8&subAreaID=0&query=house&cat=apa&minAsk=&maxAsk=1400&bedrooms=2)

who knows what the quality is like though!

Btw, I think you made the right move by going to the Bay area - it's much nicer than San Diego.
And here I thought everyone who lived in San Diego loved it to death :) is the grass always greener? do tell about the bad things please.

-clint

[Jim Buck]

Interesting - a lot of those are North Park. I always got the impressions that North Park is a little dangerous of an area, but I'm not sure why I have that impressions. Hillcrest area could be cool as long as you are aware of it's status as being the same as Massachusettes' Ptown.

Actually, San Diego is pretty awesome. The weather really can't be beat, and there are a lot of cool and interesting areas here. It's just that I fell in love with San Francisco when I went to GDC last year. The core city part of that city is just plain awesome, and the wine regions are to die for.

[robleong]

Btw, I think you made the right move by going to the Bay area - it's much nicer than San Diego.
Jim, don't discourage Clint. I think if you like sun, sand, and sea, San Diego is THE place to live. However, I do find San Diego quite conservative, whereas there's much more variety, spice, and bohemian fun in the bay area. And, unlike Jim, I don't even drink wine!

As for North Park, my former boss lives there - there's an expensive section of North Park located beside Balboa park, but for the most part I get the same sense as Jim that it isn't that good a place to live. Hillcrest is rather arty-farty, and is probably the same as the Castro district in San Francisco. UTC is expensive, but for $1300/month, I think you could possibly get 2-bedroom apartments (not houses) in most decent locations.

[robleong]

And here I thought everyone who lived in San Diego loved it to death :) is the grass always greener?
Oh, and talking about green grass, almost all the grass in San Diego is artificially watered... There is a dearth of rain, so when it actually rains, just watch out for the traffic accidents. :)

[Jim Buck]

And if you *are* a wine-drinker, San Diego also has a wine region to die for.. more like pass out for. :) There are a few excellent places in the Escondido wine country, and a bunch of off the beaten path in the Temecula wine country have simple amazing wine.

[C.S.Brewer]

Oh, and talking about green grass, almost all the grass in San Diego is artificially watered... There is a dearth of rain, so when it actually rains, just watch out for the traffic accidents. :)
heh

I lived in palm desert for a while, it was the same there, dangerous when it rains!

And if you *are* a wine-drinker, San Diego also has a wine region to die for.. more like pass out for. There are a few excellent places in the Escondido wine country, and a bunch of off the beaten path in the Temecula wine country have simple amazing wine.

mmm having someone drive you around while you drink all the wine you can take and eat fancy snacks....that's not a bad life. mmmm

[Jim Buck]

mmm having someone drive you around while you drink all the wine you can take and eat fancy snacks....that's not a bad life. mmmm

There are quite a few limo tours for this. I've never done one, but the idea is pretty cool. :)