MIDI vs. MOD

[Phil Steinmeyer]

OK, so I'm still trying to decide between MIDI and MOD (or compressed MOD - i.e. OXM or MO3) for my music.

MIDI
Good:
Very small - ~10K per song
Very easy - support already in SDL_Mixer that I'm using.
X-Platform - To Mac, and also to Java (which I plan to port to), and perhaps to Palm and/or mobile devices

Bad:
Sound quality/variety/consistency


MOD
Good:
Sound quality/variety/consistency

Bad:
Bigger - from 200-800K per song, depending on how many instruments used, compression, etc.
Harder - straight MOD will work in SDL_Mixer, no problem. But the compressed versions demand custom coding and/or a custom library (FMOD or Bass), which adds a bit of cost and complexity. Plus, the tools for working with the compressed formats seem a bit dodgy.
Availability - Fewer musicians work with these formats, and there are no buyout libraries available that I can find. I'll probably go custom music anyways, but the ability to buy a MIDI song for $40 and drop it in, at least as a placeholder, is nice.


So, I'm wondering what people's thoughts are. Also, a specific question - one hears about inconsistent MIDI playback (based on what sound tables the average 4 year old PC has), but how much of an issue is this really for PCs from ~1999 on - will the songs sound really different/bad, or is this just the kind of thing that would only bother the fringe case music wonk?

[Robert Cummings]

Midi doesn't sound the same from machine to machine, that eliminates it right there doesn't it?

Go with XM, and then if you use FMOD, compress using their utility to oxm, or if you use BASS, compress with their utility to mo3. Files will be tiny and sound great.

If pocket pc really is the destination for sure, and you don't plan on having different music for it, then your answer is right there: use midi. You know the answers yourself really...

[PoV]

Another downside of tracked music is sample redundancy, especially when you get near a dozen songs. Sure, it can be solved, but there's no drop in solution for it that I can think of. Either way, even without a compressed sample format, as is XM/IT/S3M/MOD's are still usually a savings over MP3 or OGG.

[Greg Squire]

I know I've heard lots of people say that they hate MIDI music and are "put off" by it. Personally, I don't mind it so much, but it definately has sort of a retro feel to it now. I've always thought that MOD was a good middle ground, giving quality near what you could get with MP3 or OGG, but with sizes closer to that of MIDI. There will always be a quality vs. size tradeoff battle. You just have to decide where the line is for your game.

My recomendation would be to go the MOD route in an XM format; that is if this is a downloadable game in the PC and/or Mac market.

[soniCron]

My vote is XM all the way. The little bit of extra effort implimenting XM playback is worth the audio difference. Many gamers are expecting fully recorded soundtracks nowadays and a MIDI song sticks out like a sore thumb. There was a developer who posted recently; he had ported one of their cell-phone games to the PC. Well, he left the MIDI music, and there was a lot of negative feedback about that choice. It sounded cheap; just not good enough.

I strongly advise you use a module format, preferably XM. There's no need to work with the compressed version; that is something you roll at the end of the project. The filesize isn't quite as big as you expect (200-800KB per song) if you have more music. (2MB XM with 2 hours music = 17KB per minute) The quality difference is noticable, and digital music is simply expected these days. You may know more than me, but I can't fathom that more musicians do MIDI sequencing than MOD tracking. (At least, MIDI sequencing with the expectation of MIDI playback.)

Just my two cents. I think you'd be making a big mistake going with MIDI. It reeks of "cheapo."

[Abscissa]

I think you'd be making a big mistake going with MIDI. It reeks of "cheapo." Ditto. MIDI sounds completely different on different soundcards, which means that it will sound wrong on most of them. I used MIDI in a game myself a few years ago, and I learned firsthand: it is a very bad idea.

one hears about inconsistent MIDI playback ... will the songs sound really different/bad, ...? Yes. They will definitely sound "really different/bad" on a significant number of systems. Even if it sounds fine on yours.

[disaffected]

another bad thing about MOD: only really suitable for techno and synth/beat oriented music.
if you want to use orchestral music, MOD might not be the best size/quality solution.

[soniCron]

another bad thing about MOD: only really suitable for techno and synth/beat oriented music.
if you want to use orchestral music, MOD might not be the best size/quality solution. While somewhat true about orchestral music, you're totally wrong that MOD is only suitable for techno and synth/beat oriented music. Most "homemade" music (which counts for the vast majority of MODs out there) is techno, because tecnho is easy to sequence and happens to be popular among the techie crowd. But any percussion based instrument fares very well in MOD form. Piano, harps, drums, guitar picking, etc. Not only that, but MOD is flexible enough that you can record whatever may sound unnatural in the MOD as a loop, and play that full track back, and nobody's any wiser. I've heard some excellent jazz music in MOD format, as well as some good guitar work too. (Check out "Guitar Slinger," and "Seaside Hotel.") I totally disagree with you.

[Robert Cummings]

Thing is, Midi was never designed for general music playback on a pc much less a game. It's designed for professional keyboards to play back a sequence, not a sound card...

[disaffected]

I've heard some excellent jazz music in MOD format, as well as some good guitar work too. (Check out "Guitar Slinger," and "Seaside Hotel.") I totally disagree with you.

I never said mods couldn't do other style other than techno/beat oriented music, I just said that it was more suitable toward doing that type of music and not orchestral music.

[Ryan Clark]

Our game "Professor Fizzwizzle" uses Ogg compressed XM files, and the music isn't techno. It's more like playful/suspenseful music.

Download it and have a listen!

[soniCron]

...I just said that it was more suitable toward doing that type of music and not orchestral music. Yes. I know what you said. And I said I disagreed with you. ;)

[Bad Sector]

Or even better, use IT (Impulse Tracker module): it's widely supported (not as XM, but AFAIK both FMOD and BASS can play them - and the LGPL libmikmod can do it too), has more effects than XM and the file is compressed.

[soniCron]

Or even better, use IT (Impulse Tracker module): it's widely supported (not as XM, but AFAIK both FMOD and BASS can play them - and the LGPL libmikmod can do it too), has more effects than XM and the file is compressed. True, but there are a few reasons why not to use it:

Tracker support is limited.
Higher CPU requirement because of the realtime effects.
The compression is negligible compared to OXM or MO3.

That said, my personal favorite is IT, but I wouldn't recommend it, or use it myself, in a game release.

[disaffected]

Yes. I know what you said. And I said I disagreed with you. ;)
we'll just have to agree to disagree. :D



Or even better, use IT (Impulse Tracker module): it's widely supported (not as XM, but AFAIK both FMOD and BASS can play them - and the LGPL libmikmod can do it too), has more effects than XM and the file is compressed.


ITs are pretty good, but you can't further compress them with OXM or other mod sample compressors. :o

[Olivier]

MinuteMatch uses IT, and the style isn't techno. Bu I wasn't aware of the CPU requirement. I don't if our musician used effects. :)

[soniCron]

MinuteMatch uses IT, and the style isn't techno. Bu I wasn't aware of the CPU requirement. I don't if our musician used effects. :) I don't know if the effects IT uses are significant overhead, but realtime DSP is incredibly slow no matter which way you cut it. It's certainly not a horrible idea, though. Unfortunately, realtime DSP + software rendering = kills old machines! ;)

And if he didn't use any of the effects, it somewhat negates the purpose of using IT in the first place. May as well go with the far more standard XM. No reason not to.