What hours do full time Indies work?

[Peter Wayne]

I'm just wondering what hours do you all work? I tend to think that not many people would actually work a 9-5 in the indie world.

Do you set your alarm and get up at a normal work time? Do you work untill 4am in the morning? What does your normal day consist of.

I'm just courisous is all.

I consider myself a full time indie audio specialist. I dont make games but I contribute to them, as I work in all area's of game audio. Which is Music, Sound Design and Voice acting. My normal day starts around midday after I have done all the normal life stuff like eat, shower and a few emails ect... It all depends on how busy I am but, it's not unlikly to be still up working at around 3am. I'm more of a night person anyway. Is this life normal among indie gamers? I guess i'm lucky in that I dont have that many responsibilities, like taking kids to school or anything like that.

So what's everyone's normal working hours?

[Jack Norton]

I usually work 10 hours a day, from 8-9 AM up to midnight (of course I have lunch and dinner, so the average hours a day are 10).

[Mark Fassett]

I typically work until 3 or 4 in the morning, and wake about 10am. I spend most of that time in front of the computer, but I take time out whenever I feel like it. I also have to watch my son in the mornings, so I don't get alot of work done then ;)

[Chris Evans]

Yikes Mark...my schedule is just about identical to yours.

Work till 3-5am, wake up at 10-11am. I also have to watch my son for the first half of the day, so my productivity is hit or miss around then.

Though I was actually on a semi-normal work schedule until recently. But I'm trying to get my game out in the next few weeks, so I'm pretty much working around the clock.

[Nemesis]

(sometimes) Wake at 7:00, go cycling, get a shower, go to work (day job)
(often) Wake at 8:00, get s ashower, go to work (day job)
9:00-17:30 (ish) day job (some forum browsing - I admit :))
17:30-19:00 - check emails, fora, maybe start some work
19:00:20:00 - gf comes over, we cook
20:00 - 02:00 - indie work (gf stays till about 22:30 and studies, crafts, draws etc)

(edit - more here)
That's unless I have evening errands, social events (friends etc). I usually also make use of the day job break to get errands done, or substitute the early cycling ride for an early errand.
On Saturdays it's usually working at my new place, and maybe go out in the evening. On Suinday's it's usually family meeting day, go in the country side in Winter and swimming in Summer.
Other interruptions to my routine are business abroad, that is, the UK.

As you can see, I try to time-manage my life like a freak! :)

[tentons]

I get up at 6am, toss the kids on the bus, kiss the lady as she leaves for work, and then work until about 6 or 7pm (sometimes, but not often, I'll go all the way until 10pm). There is lunch, dinner, etc, so it's probably about 9-12 hours per day.

I force myself to not work at all on Saturdays, though, and Sundays are usually pretty unproductive but I don't push it.

Once I have some cash flow, I'll slow down some. But it's what I love, so I don't consider it "work". I'm sure most of you agree. :)

[luggage]

Same here really.

Get up about 11am, work until 3-4 am. Hardest part is stopping your body clock just drifting around until you're sleeping till 5pm and working till 10am.

[Hamumu]

You guys are nuts! I work about 5 hours a day. From when I run out of political flamewars to read and have deleted all my spam, until 4pm, which is the earliest I allow myself to play videogames (with a 1/2-1 hour lunch break).

[Mark Fassett]

I force myself to not work at all on Saturdays, though, and Sundays are usually pretty unproductive but I don't push it.

I forgot - my schedule includes Saturdays and Sundays, unless there are family gatherings. But on those days, I don't have to watch the kid :) One of these days, I probably ought to start taking those days off. But it's sooooo hard.

[botman]

Well I'm just starting out at the whole indie thing, but I'm having a fair bit of trouble finding hours when I'm productive.

The problem is I work a night-shift (about 10pm till between 1 and 4 am) that's very physical, and so by the time you get home, you're wide awake (though physically exhausted) and as such, I seldom get to bed before 6am. Waking any time between 11am and 4pm (lol), I usually go for a walk to grab whatever sunlight is left for the day (it's Winter or something), or go to Uni, or my day job. Get home, have tea, and then seem to be getting ready for work again.

It's not that I get no free time, I just never seem to have the energy to program much when I do, so spend too much time to unimportant things (such as redrawing graphics over and over even though I know I can't draw).

[Kai Backman]

I usually work 9-5 with a normal five day week. If productivity runs high for some reason I'm flexible and work later. However, I have found out that after one or two late nighters I usually need to sleep out, so they don't really push up the total productive hours. Oh, and I wear a suit to office .. Just kidding .. I don't use a tie .. :)

[Chris Evans]

You guys are nuts! I work about 5 hours a day. From when I run out of political flamewars to read and have deleted all my spam, until 4pm, which is the earliest I allow myself to play videogames (with a 1/2-1 hour lunch break).

Well you have the luxury of already having games to sell. :) I'm still trying to finish up my first game, so I feel extremely guilty and stressed if I procrastinate too much since I have zero income coming in. Though I imagine once my game is released and gets going, I'll be able to have a more relaxed schedule.

[mathgenius]

I do about 4 hours a day.. Every day. It's always the first thing: if I have a 9am appointment, I get up at 3-4am so I can do my work.

Sometimes it's longer than that (up to 10hours), but when it's intense cerebral work, 4 hours in and i'm a vegetable :)

Simon.

[Ratboy]

I usually put in 8 or more hours a day when working, but I spread it out through the day and take a lot of breaks.

(For artists, procrastination is a vital part of the creative process... ;) )

[svero]

My schedule varies quite a bit. I actually don't need to do much right now. Twilight self runs more or less so I could stop doing anything for a few years without it having much impact. That being said... when I am working I work a lot and when I'm slacking off I slack off like a pro.

Last week I was getting up around 1pm and starting work around 11 at night till 4am. This week I haven't done a thing. Next week? Who knows!

[Peter Wayne]

Well I'm just starting out at the whole indie thing, but I'm having a fair bit of trouble finding hours when I'm productive.

The problem is I work a night-shift (about 10pm till between 1 and 4 am) that's very physical, and so by the time you get home, you're wide awake (though physically exhausted) and as such, I seldom get to bed before 6am. Waking any time between 11am and 4pm (lol), I usually go for a walk to grab whatever sunlight is left for the day (it's Winter or something), or go to Uni, or my day job. Get home, have tea, and then seem to be getting ready for work again.

It's not that I get no free time, I just never seem to have the energy to program much when I do, so spend too much time to unimportant things (such as redrawing graphics over and over even though I know I can't draw).

I hear you! I used to work a full time job that was physical and had an early 6am start. I would get nothing done after work. I found the only thing I could do was to relax playing a few games or watching a movie. Nothing productive! I then cut my hours right back to about 2-3 days a week. Even the 2-3 days a week was too much down time as I it would take a day or two to recover from the 2-3 days hard work. I had to give away working a regular job. It just wasn't working. Money is hard to come by now, but I wouldn't trade it for anything. Not many people get up each morning (or afternoon) excited about the day. I'm proud to be one of those people. I just wish I could get more regular paid work. Which is not an easy task in game audio.

Thanks to everyone who has posted in this thread! I enjoy knowing what everyone else's "regular" day is.

Does anyone find it very annoying that people think that becasue you run your own business that you can just take time off whenever you like. People expect that I can take a holiday whenever i like. Or that I can drop everything to help them do whatever because you can do your work later.
It seems that people dont relize that we actually work very hard. I dont know if it's just me, but people think that because I dont have to get up at any particular time that i'm not very productive. Or even classed as a slacker. It doesn't bother me that much as I enjoy what I do! Which to me is all that matters. I actually think that people are very jealous that I get to work my own hours. What are everyone's thoughts and experiences?

But as I said I wouldn't trade it for anything! :D

[Nemesis]

Does anyone find it very annoying that people think that becasue you run your own business that you can just take time off whenever you like.I can't really say from personal experience, but from the experience that an aquaintance of mine has running a building contracting business, he would often work up to 12-13 ours dailing, in order to catch up with all the issues, paperwork and stuff. Any holiday for him is a headache because he still needs to stay in touch with his delegates somehow or other.

[Jemander9]

I get up at about 8 and go straight to work (I work from home). Typically I'll do 15 hours a day.

[Reactor]

I usually get up around 10am, and really get stuck into things about midday. Then I'll work until about 1-2am as much as I can.

[GBGames]

Does anyone find it very annoying that people think that becasue you run your own business that you can just take time off whenever you like. People expect that I can take a holiday whenever i like. Or that I can drop everything to help them do whatever because you can do your work later.

This summer I wanted to pursue game development as my full time self employed job. I would keep a part time job on the side to have some cash to spend, but otherwise I would have most of my time to myself.

I asked my parents for support in this, as I just graduated and I still live with them. I would need to live with them since my part time position wouldn't pay for an apartment or the expenses that go with it. They said they would support me.

A week or so into it, I find out from my sister that my parents are not happy that I decided not to get a full time position somewhere. When confronting my parents, I found out that this was the case, but they never wanted to say that they didn't support me. My mom would say, "Well, since you said you won't make money right away, why not get a full time job to pay for it in the meantime?" Good idea, Mom. I wish I had thought of that...oh wait, I did. And we talked about it before when you said it was fine.

This really threw a monkey wrench into my plans as now I have decided that I need to become self-sufficient and move out of my parents' house. When I was originally planning on working only 20 hours weeks this summer, I now find myself wanting to get more. When I was looking forward to working for myself, I find myself actively looking for someone else to hire me. I currently work more part-time hours and I am looking for a job. Graduate school starts up again in the next couple of weeks, taking up even more time.

The other day, my mom saw me sitting at the computer trying to install some video drivers and asks, "Is that the game you're working on?" "No." "Are you still working on it?" "No." "What, did you give up?" "No, I didn't give up. When do I have time?"

To be honest, I could make time to make my game, but I use it to try to find a job instead. I was actually looking forward to getting asked to do laundry or make dinner during my "work" time. Now, I just have someone who thinks that I just have time to do work, school, and extra work, on top of other duties, and still has the right to get upset at me for doing "nothing."

Sorry for the rant. I do game development/design research or design work on my existing ideas in the time I do get, since I don't usually get more than 15 minutes of it. But nothing gets me more frustrated than being told that it was perfectly fine to do something, but then have it all be a lie. It will be really nice when the only person I have to rely on is myself, but that currently requires me to get a full time position to do so.

I'm breathing now. I shall be fine. B-)

[Chris Evans]

I understand your frustration GBGames. Many people don't understand entrepreneurs.

You have to remember though, seeing is believing for a lot of people. When I initially entertained the idea of leaving my full-time job to go Indie, my wife was just as skeptical (if not more so) then your parents. However, when I started to get serious about it, I put a prototype of my game together and showed it to my wife. I went into detail explaining exactly what I was doing with the game and business. Once she saw what I was doing was "real", she opened up a lot more. As the game resembled more and more like a real game, she became one of my biggest supporters.

If you're living with a spouse or your parents, you need to treat them like investors. Don't just talk about the business on paper, show them the actual game/prototype and give them a thorough understanding of what your trying to accomplish. I'm not guaranteeing they'll agree with you in the end, but you should make a concentrated effort to help them understand what your doing. You have to give a great sales pitch. They may not be investing millions into your business, but they're most likely will be investing moral support, patience, and providing a roof over your head until your business gets going.

This may also mean you may have to clean up your computer area and make it look more like an office. Put up a whiteboard and calendar and list your weekly goals or tasks. This is not just for show, this will also help yourself to take your business more seriously. Personally whenever I see myself getting unproductive my office tends to be an absolute mess. When I clean it, I feel a lot better and my family tends to respect my work area more.

Anyway good luck! I'm sure you'll overcome this latest hurdle.

[PoV]

I'm not full time, but I think I've finally got a strategy that works for me. My day job is making games, and I've always found it hard to work on my own games after work. Aparently this took me 5 years to figure out ('cause I'm a crazy sleeping in person, 11AM to 4PM if I didn't have to wake up for work).

Simply, I wake up extra early, and work on my games before work. So now, Tuesday to Friday, I wake up somewhere between 4:30 and 6:00 AM, work a couple hours on my game (also banning myself from checking forums, etc...), then head off to work. After work I go home, do whatever (draw, surf (net), etc...), do a small refresher of my code or read a chapter/article in related book/site, and head off to bed between 9 and 11, and think about what to tackle the next day as I drift off to sleepy land.

[GBGames]

Chris, thanks for the advice.

Basically that sounds like the case. I currently don't have anything to show for it, and so they assume I am not doing anything.

I've decided that I'm tired of living under their roof though, so I am still going to try to find a full time position and move out. Working part time on my game isn't the end of the world, and it was in fact one of the options I gave myself when I first discussed it with my parents. I could work part time on my business while getting a full time job, or I could work full time on my business but need them to support me financially, etc. It was just one of those, "Sure, honey, of course we support you" == "Why doesn't he shape up and get a job?"

In the meantime, I have come up with a few treatments, and one of them seems to get my friends excited when I give the elevator pitch to them. At the very least, I know exactly which project to pursue first, so I can be focused when I work on it in the few moments I will have to do so. B-)

Thanks again for the advice.

[Coyote]

If you're living with a spouse or your parents, you need to treat them like investors.
That's incredibly cool advice, Chris.

I'm not full-time, but I've found that's true even if you are a part-time developer. There's a significant impact on time when you are doing this - time you aren't devoting to your family. It's not just your own sacrifice of time. I spoke with my wife at length with what I was doing, and involve her on progress reports with how the game is doing, things I'm learning, etc. It's a family business, even if the rest of my family isn't directly involved in developing the game (my oldest daughter does help me test out multiplayer, though...)

[Greg Squire]

If you're living with a spouse or your parents, you need to treat them like investors.

That’s definitely a good way to think of it. I have full time position (web development), and have started doing this in some spare time, and with a wife and several kids it’s not easy to find (or rather “make”) some “spare time”. My wife is supportive, but she doesn’t want this to take too much away from family time (rightly so). I’m hoping eventually that this will go well enough that I can make this a full-time endeavor. When I mentioned this possibility of not having a “full time job”, she was concerned about what we would do for good health insurance. The prospect of loosing this company sponsored health insurance, and other benefits was a little unnerving for her. The funny thing is that she has a brother, and a brother-in-law that are both successful businessmen. I also have a few friends that are running businesses, and some are doing quite well. She knows it’s possible, but I guess she also knows the risks. There are definitely some risks involved in any entrepreneurial endeavor, but I guess for a lot of people (even close family) it’s hard to shake the “corporate ladder” mindset.

I know there are some downsides to being self employed (finding good health care, getting mortgage loans, possibly lower income, etc.), but there are a lot of upsides too (being able to set your own schedule and pace, possibly higher income, etc.) No one got to the top by climbing a rope that was thrown down to them; they had to blaze their own path to the top (many times without any safety net).

Hopefully we all see each other at the top! Good Luck to us all!

[formfarbeminze]

Well I'm just starting out at the whole indie thing, but I'm having a fair bit of trouble finding hours when I'm productive.

The problem is I work a night-shift (about 10pm till between 1 and 4 am) as


the same for me. so i organized my way around those nigh-shifts. that means i wake up 18:30 do some sports, take a shower. the days i have to work on one of those night-shifts i leave house to go to work at 19:40. if i have a free day, i leave house at the same time to do the social thingys like meeting with friends etc sometimes i start earlier, but the last call to indie work is at 23:00 i will then work until 5:00 at least sometimes until 8:00. that would be dinner-time for me. after dinner, from 9.00 - 10.00 i do my errands as well as catch-the-sunlight. around 11:00 i fall into sleep.

redrawing graphics over and over even though I know I can't draw).

but that's excactly the way you learn to draw! so, at the moment you are learning how to draw :-)

[z.e.r.o]

Depends a lot, 8-10 h a day when I can do it (no contracts or weekends without anything to do), otherwise usually I work from 18 to 24 (in some hairy situations even 02).

[Coyote]

I'm a part-time indie, though lately it's been more like having two full-time jobs.

I wake up at 7, get ready for the day, and go to work. I get home around 6. I spend 2-3 hours eating, spending time with the family, maybe watching a third of a movie to give myself a break from the computer. Then I'm back to work sometime between 8 and 9, and work until 1 AM. Or until 2. Or even 3. Depending. The last week or so, it's been going into the 2-3 range. (2:30 last night). I quickly go to bed, and crash for 4-6 hours before getting up again for a new day.

[Uhfgood]

My schedule is all over the place. Although lately it's been, waking up around 10... not getting much doen till later, dad comes home, I work at night from 9pm-2am. But he expects me to take a work day from 7 or 8 am till 4-5 pm. This is what i'm trying to do now, but it's kind of hard. And why work around my Dad's schedule. For one, no rent to pay, and him not kicking me out. He could have booted me out years ago, but instead let me do this. But i do have the requirement of spending time with him when he gets home, usually involves eating dinner, and watching tv/movies till his bedtime. Lately I haven't been doing that normal work a full day then call it quits when he comes home. So i've been trying to readjust my schedule, this is why i'm looking into goal setting now.

Keith

[kevryan]

Back quite a long while ago when I was with a company I used to work until 4-5am and then come back into work a little before noon. I can remember walking home with my wife and we would have 'dinner' at IHOP (is it still there near Ferry Street Bridge in Eugene?) at 5 in the morning. Once you have kids normal life forces you to get to more normal hours.

Now that my commute is only 10 feet my hours vary day to day. Sometimes I'll be working from 7 in the morning until 11 at night. Sometimes big breaks within that time frame. My kids will come in and out throughout the day. It is nice to be able to adjust my work hours to fit my current life situations.