Are you a negative person?

[Black Hydra]

I picked up some reading material over the holidays. One book on writing online copy, and another called "The Sales Bible" by Jeffrey Gitomer. The Sales Bible was more about face to face selling and I actually found it to be a source of greater information about social dealings and personality than selling, but valuable none-the-less.

Anyways. To get to my point. The book had a the results of a study in which it was determined WHY salespeople failed. It turned out that 50% of the failure was due to attitude problems. Now obviously, with the much larger separation from your customers that value would be a bit lower for people in our business. However, I have to agree that it is ATTITUDE that will determine inevitable success or failure. Sure, a positive outlook won't make the first game a success, but it will give you the energy to perservere hardships that would break a negative spirited person.

Now I'm sure most, if not all of you are saying: "I'm a positive person.", or "I'm a positive person, its xxx is why I'm not selling!" (an oxymoron if I ever saw one). Or perhaps your saying "He's full of sh*t". Well think what you want.

Want to know if your a positive person? (Hopefully I can be allowed this little reprint without getting sued... but I had to share)

Answer these questions with a yes or no. If it is a 'maybe' then it counts as a yes.

1) I watch the news for about 1 hour a day.
2) I read the paper every day.
3) I read a news magazine every week.
4) Sometimes I have a bad day, all day.
5) My job is a drag.
6) I get angry for an hour or more.
7) I talk to and commiserate with negative people
8) I look to blame others when something goes wrong.
9) When something goes wrong or bad, I tell others.
10) I get angry at my spouse and don't talk for more than 4 hours.
11) I bring personal problems to work and discuss them.
12) I expect and plan for the worst.
13) I'm affected by bad weather (cold, hot, rainy) enough to talk about it.

Tally up your YES's and NO's.

First of all I would like to tell you that if you fail this test, don't feel too bad (thats being negative! ...lol...). It turns out that only 1 in 1000 people in this world are positive thinkers. Even though most people say they are....

I considered myself a positive upbeat person, but I failed this test. I guess there is work to be done...

WANT TO KNOW IF YOU PASSED?

0-2 YES's - You are a positive person! You are on the road to success!
3-6 YES's - You have a negative attitude... (I got 4 BTW)
7 or more - You have a seriously negative attitude that will affect your life adversely and you NEED TO FIX THE PROBLEM NOW!!!

If you got more than 4, my book suggests that you go and invest in tapes that will improve your attitude.

If you start saying your a "REALIST" and that you believe that your simply being honest about your situation
SLAP YOURSELF RIGHT NOW!!
There is no such thing as a realist. Everything in life is attitude.

Now I'm not perfect (I failed remember?), but I hope to be the messenger of change. Go out and fix your attitude and your life!

If you have a positive attitude you will have
more money
better relationships
be happier
be healthier
even live longer!

PS - Post your results to the test. I want to see what people scored well and look if there is any specific corellation between successful indies and attitude.

Cya

Oh and have a GREAT DAY! :D :D :D

EDIT: Sheesh! :eek: It seems I am met mostly with opposition to the credibility of my source of information. I thought this might snap some people out of there negativity like it has done for me. Apparently it has only been concluded as bullshit and that positive attitudes aren't that important anyways. Believe what you want.

[arcadetown]

These are signs of negativity? Ok...

1) I watch the news for about 1 hour a day.
2) I read the paper every day.
3) I read a news magazine every week.

[george]

i got a 12, ouch...


These are signs of negativity? Ok...

1) I watch the news for about 1 hour a day.
2) I read the paper every day.
3) I read a news magazine every week.

i think it means that if you keep up with the news a lot, you see/read a lot of terrible things that are happening in the world, which gives you lots of sad emotions and fills your head with sad images, which eqauls lots of negativity

[otaku]

I got one "Aye". Number 6. I get all my anger out at trivial non-essential stuff, then I go about my life with almost nothing at all affecting me (except maybe my "no social graces/skills" room-mate).

It would have been two but the word "expect" in number 12 makes that a "no." I expect the best and plan for the worst.

And I think this pop-quiz is a lot of bollocks. :) Would saying that be considered negative?

Yes. These forums are full of negativity. The SNR is utterly awful. There is an occasional nugget worth chewing on. Why do you think I don't post very often? Intelligent discourse is very hard to come by. I've been thinking of starting my own "invite only" forums. With drinking. And poker. And dancing girls. And developers. In fact, forget the d...

[luggage]

A load of negative nonsense! It's just a way of making money. "score more than 4? Buy my tapes!"

This is the kind of rubbish I don't want to read. Who says I'm negative? Who says I'm positive? Why is there hard and fast rules? How can there be a hard line between 'positive' and 'negative'.

I know 'positive' thinkers who fail. I know 'negative' thinkers who succeed.

Incidentally I scored 2 yes'es which makes me 1 in a 1000? I don't think so. I'm negative about this test that I scored a positive result on.

[Ricardo C]

Watching the news and reading the paper make me negative? Gee, I though it just made me more informed than the average yokel. Oh, well.

And yes, I AM a realist. I hope and work for the best, but never lose sight of the fact that many things can go wrong at any given time.

[PoV]

Sweet, I'm a happy person... though I think the questions are a tad dated and don't lend themselves to people that have embraced the net. Not to mention I agree it's just a means to sell stuff... but a good idea, playing on peoples habbits like that, and telling them they have a problem. :D

[Vorax]

There is no such thing as a realist. Everything in life is attitude.

There is such a thing as a realist. All being a realist means is that you truly try to base your decisions on knowledge and logic, not hope (optimist) or fear (pessimist).

I try to be a realist in everything I do.

I don't think things will fail or succeed on faith or lack of, I simply base it on statistical crunching in my head. Like playing Chess, you don't wish for a good move, you plan it and execute it. You don't think it's hopeless until the facts of the board tell you it is. Then you simply have to conceed.

My cup is neither half full or half empty...it contains 175ml :)

PS: I scored 1 on your test

[Rainer Deyke]

I never thought of myself as a positive person, but appearently I am one. More power to me, I guess.

[Anthony Flack]

i think it means that if you keep up with the news a lot, you see/read a lot of terrible things that are happening in the world, which gives you lots of sad emotions and fills your head with sad images, which eqauls lots of negativity


So all news is bad news, eh? Sounds like that test is taking a pretty negative attitude to me.


It turns out that only 1 in 1000 people in this world are positive thinkers.

Yes, that test definitely has an attitude problem. And if you think that it's just being realistic, SLAP YOURSELF!

[Sharpfish]

Well I got "3" so I guess I am negative ;)

I know I have negative traits to a few aspects of my life, but they don't really enter my games dev or other creative endeavours(well except when I used to do my music, in which case it helps write better songs! ;) ) - mainly I get over things quickly and feel motivated and ready to try again. If it is something I can control, or do something about then I will remain positive no matter how bad it gets.

If I feel I am "stuck" (i.e. A bad workplace) and I need to go for the Money - then yes I will get negative (don't we all?).

So remove the money/lack of money aspects from it and I would say I am a fairly optimistic (sometimes through escapism) person.

And hey, I didn't see a score of "3" as bad - I was actually happy with that so there we go. :) < see

[Fantus]

If you got more than 4, my book suggests that you go and invest in tapes that will improve your attitude.

Also sold by the guy who wrote the book, right?

[yanuart]

lol.. i'm a negative person.. but I don't know why reading paper/watching news everyday makes me a negative person ?? It's almost like ahabit during my private moment at the toilet :D

hmm.. this is a great way to market your books/products :
1. Take this test
2. IF the result is bad, then buy one of my product
3. if you don't believe the result then you really need to buy my product
4. if the result is good.. hey.. it's only 1 in a thousand :D
ohh this is negative me again.. darn.. btw did the book tell the difference between being negative and being critical ?

[princec]

I'm sorta middle of the road.

Cas :)

[terin]

When will people realize that self-help is something that comes from the self, not from a book.

It's a shame that someone is making money of selling bullshit: But then, that is the mark of a good salesman.

Me, I think I will stick to being negative and very well informed about the world around me. This way when a toxic cloud moves through your door to door selling area I will be safe and you'll be very dead.

*eye roll* I am very tired of people labling other people are negative or positive on this forum. There's more to life than black and white descriptors. Plenty of negative people are very successful salespeople, it only matters if you are selling something that ISN'T worth selling.

If your product is the best then skill and knowledge alone are enough to make sales, and in the long run, will outsell crappy product sold by happy and uneducated people.

Go get a refund on that book and find a better way to improve your life. I suggest meditation as a much more valuable self-help tool than someone's uneducated opinion.

-Joe

[Vorax]

Good point Joe! There are way to many threads about negativity and/or postive thinking lately. It just causes debate and solves nothing.

[Black Hydra]

No, the author wasn't suggesting any books written by himself.

Second, his opinion isn't 'uneducated' as he has made millions of dollars training salespeople. His book is currently in its 18th reprinting and his sales column "Sales Move" is currently read by 3.5 million people. If you don't want to believe him, you don't have to, but he isn't some bum selling snake oil. I have also read information from many other successful people and I can name several that stress the importance of a positive attitude. I can't name one that ever said it was better to be negative.

Terin, you know a lot of 'very successful' sales people that have very negative attitudes? Name one.

You also make the assumption that it is the product and skill that determine success in the long run. Seeing as your already disputing the information in the book, and information supported by many other successful people, I'm not going to use the fact that the book goes to great lengths to disprove this as an arguement. Simply put, product and skill are short-term. Asside from the whole process (which is affected by attitude), I must say that it is ATTITUDE and not product that will determine long-term success. I think princec said it best when he claimed that if he made a Dweep clone it still wouldn't sell anywhere near as good as Steve's does.

I think in all the time you spend watching out for that toxic cloud that is going to come rolling by, your going to miss opportunities.

Look, I have no intentions on arguing with you and I wish you all the success in the world. I think meditation is very good, but without focus it will only amplify the thoughts currently in my head. I'd like to amplify uplifting, motivating and positive ones, but you can do as you wish.

Vorax - I have to agree with you that these posts about attitude are going nowhere. This is my fault as I didn't believe anyone would go to great lengths to dispute my information and my beliefs.

I apologize for making this thread. My intentions were to share the revelation I had, that I don't have as good an attitude as I thought. I hope it gave the same revelation in someone else, but it seems to have only stirred up debate about the merits of the information I boasted at the topic starter.

[Abscissa]

I can say right now I'm a very jaded, negative person. But here's my results anyway:

1) I watch the news for about 1 hour a day: Never
2) I read the paper every day: Never
3) I read a news magazine every week: Never
4) Sometimes I have a bad day, all day: Yes
5) My job is a drag: Yes
6) I get angry for an hour or more: Yes
7) I talk to and commiserate with negative people: No
8) I look to blame others when something goes wrong: Yes
9) When something goes wrong or bad, I tell others: Yes
10) I get angry at my spouse and don't talk for more than 4 hours: N/A (No)
11) I bring personal problems to work and discuss them: No
12) I expect and plan for the worst: Yes
13) I'm affected by bad weather (cold, hot, rainy) enough to talk about it: Yes (especially here in cleveland)

Lets see...that's 7 "yes"es. Yup, I'm quite negative.

I do have a slight disagreement with this bit though:

7 or more - You have a seriously negative attitude that will affect your life adverselyIn my case (and I'm sure other people too), it worked the other way around. I used to always be a very optimistic person until the last few years when everything pretty much turned to shit. The "affect life adversely" is what caused the "seriously negative attitude". It's called "being jaded" ;).

[Abscissa]

but I don't know why reading paper/watching news everyday makes me a negative person ??
Not sure about other parts of the world, but in the US 99.9% of the news media is over-sensationalised stuff presented in a way that's intended to scare people into gluing themselves to the evening news or the newspaper. It's all tabloids, basically, even the ones that haven't been labeled by the public as such. The only mainstream news source I've come across so far that isn't a tabloid when you really get right down to the core is BBC News and that's not even from the US.

[Teeth]

I don't even like the BBC news, they still sensationalise stuff that isn't news-worthy a lot of the time and their IT and games sections are awful. Guardian for me every time.

[Abscissa]

I don't even like the BBC news, they still sensationalise stuff that isn't news-worthy a lot of the time and their IT and games sections are awful. Guardian for me every time.
Hmm, well I haven't been paying a whole lot of attention to them. What I said about them was just based on the occasional bits that I've seen. And (from what I've seen), they at least apper to be better than anything calling itelf "Action News (http://www.woio.com/)" :rolleyes:.

[Black Hydra]

I have to apologize for my thread.

I made the thread with the notion that everyone already believed that positive thinking was better than negative thinking.

I also had the notion that everybody believed that attitude makes a big impact on your life.

I didn't respect the viewpoints of others, and for that I apologize. I do think there is room for healthy debate, but I think that I am on the road to unhealthy arguement.

As much as I do believe in the above statements, I also respect that some people do not. I can understand it is a bit like when a Christian told me I would go to hell because I wasn't Christian. The whole arguement is illogical, because as an aethiest I didn't believe in hell, so the arguement that I should be Christian was resting on the belief that I was Christian...

I had initially hoped to provide people with the same revelation I had myself. I certainly did not intend on starting a debate about either the merits of my information or the belief that positiveness was related to success.

[Abscissa]

I made the thread with the notion that everyone already believed that positive thinking was better than negative thinking.

I also had the notion that everybody believed that attitude makes a big impact on your life.
Heheh, well, despite what I said in my responses (and my general aversion towards self-help materials), I do agree with you on those two points. I, personally, do think that positive thinking is better than negative and does have a big impact. I've just been a very negative person lately anyway ;).


I didn't respect the viewpoints of others, and for that I apologize. I do think there is room for healthy debate, but I think that I am on the road to unhealthy arguement.
I don't see a problem. All you did was post your own opinion and hope that someone else might be able to gain something from it. Nothing wrong with that, even if some people disagree and state why they disagree. It's not as if you said "You all better believe this guy, or else!" Respecting the opinions of others doesn't require you to keep your own opinions to yourself, it's just not being hostile to the conflicting views.

[princec]

I used to always be a very optimistic person until the last few years when everything pretty much turned to shit.Funny, the same thing happened to me. Odd thing is - it's this forum, and a few others like it, that have kept me positive. I've made a lot of friends here, and a few MSN buddies too where we rant at each other about stuff that's a bit too nitpicky to bother posting about.

Cas :)

[princec]

Could be a great philosophical debate in the making.

Cas :)

[Escotia]

@ Black Hydra - don't stress yourself over this, I quite enjoyed this thread. I'm very cynical when it comes to self-help books in general but at the very least it's interesting to see how everyone does in little tests like this. I don't think you should worry that your guru isn't everyone elses. It's like religion - There's a lot of choice and you just have to pick your path to enlightenment and stick to it as long as you think it's getting you there.

Like others, the test seems a little odd to me. The best investment book I own stresses that I MUST try to read the Financial Times (newspaper) every day. My guru doesn't agree with yours it seems but hey, that's life.

I also have to say that Luggage might come out as positive in this test but he's actually one of the most apathetic people I know. Horizontal as they say.

[PoV]

Given all this negativity, it's surprising more people don't try to come up with games to ease, rather than fuel it. Logic and Twitch games may help you forget or take your mind off what's wrong, but they don't do anything about it. There are a number of ways to improve a mood, but I'll complain about just one for now, Humor.

My list of games that have actually made me laugh is extremely short, i.e. Disgaea (PS2). It's a tactical RPG (in an anime art style, for those hardcore Japan only freaks) starring a young egotistical Demon character that aims to reclaim his fathers throne as overlord of the Netherworld, and everything than follows. Fun stuff.

Comedy is hardly an easy thing to do, given that it is a social activity, and especially given that we're a rather anti-social group (see that old survey from months ago). Humor is relative as well. Not everyone digs 'stupid' humor like Invader Zim or Monty Python, or the ego humor of Mike Bullard or Dennis Leary, or the rude humor of South Park or (or in a way) Ren and Stimpy, or even kiddie humor like Spongebob. Short of the kiddie humor, many of the types of humor are fitting of a specific cultures. Watching a random American comedian make fun of Canadians in Montreal is funny for us, 'cause they often point out interesting details or differences between us. In fact, they'd probably be humorous to Americans as well, but unless you had a good understanding of our two cultures (or just one), it's most likely not all that funny to anyone else.

Anyways, my point is I don't think it's really been discussed, and I'm trying to start a fight here.

So tell me, why did the chicken...?

[NuriumGames]

Got a 6 :mad: :mad: :mad:


I used to always be a very optimistic person until the last few years when everything pretty much turned to shit.
This is a side effect of age :)

By the way, I would like to recommend a book about this kind of things 'Plato no Prozac!' by Lou Marinoff, as the author says is about practical philosophy or philosophy for the common daylife.

As someone said also think self help comes from self, but betters minds that ours have struggled with the same problems.

[Jay_Kyburz]

I answered no to them all, but I still find it difficult to find positive things to post about. I don't know how many times I've written a post to a forum and then on re-reading decided that it didn't need to be said.

Thier are a few I wish I hadn't hit send.

[gmcbay]

You can pretty much collapse the list of questions down to:

Do you have any idea what is going on? YES/NO.

If you answered yes, you're a negative person! Thanks for playing!

[Black Hydra]

The list is sound, but you can't expect a perfect response from 15 questions.

The ones that mention news articles are mostly because that the news, generally, is mostly promoting fear and negativity. I get all my news information from the Daily show and the Tonight Show's monolouge... (sad I know) so I didn't respond to those.

Attitude doesn't have anything to do with realism. Its more of a glass half-full, half-empty situation. Both are completely true.

The reason I apologized for the thread is that I didn't expect such cynicism towards the validity of the information.

I think that the area of personal happiness is where positive/negative attitude makes the biggest difference.

[Rainer Deyke]

I don't read the news because I can't stand the sugarcoated misinformation that passes for news in the media. I don't complain because I believe that nobody cares about my complaints. I answered yes to two questions.

[BantamCityGames]

I haven't read this entire thread, but I must say that NOT watching or reading the news has been a major factor in MY positive attitude. I don't know how people can stand to watch the news anymore... you can't turn on the news and find any "good" news. Its always "3 teenagers were beaten and killed this afternoon"... "terrorist warning has escalated to code whatever"... "negativity, negativity and more negativity". It really brings a person down sometimes.

[yanuart]

I "terrorist warning has escalated to code whatever"... .
omg, I can't believe they still running the same plot, isn;t election over allready :D

[Abscissa]

omg, I can't believe they still running the same plot, isn;t election over allready :D
You'd think it was still going on, judging by all of the Bush/Kerry bumper stickers that everyone STILL on their cars...

[Jay_Kyburz]

I was thinking more about this test last night and it occurred to me that whoever wrote it is actually quite a negative person.

The questions all focus on how much negativity you have in your life rather than how much positivity. This in its self is a negative attitude.

how about..

1. Have you made somebody smile today.
2. Did you tell anybody you love them.
3. Have you stoped to enjoy something beautiful.
etc..

Enough of this hippy shit.. anybody goat a game where I can blow something up!

[dima]

One cannot be always negative or always positive. There must be times in life that changes a person, and different days bring different feeling. Like today, I'm happy for some reason, might be the good weather, might be the new girl I met, but anyways, last week I was after blood, and barked at everyone.

My point is; last week I was negative, frustrated and irritated. This week I feel good and generous, wanting to help others around me. I don't think you can label a person permanently like this, everyone has their bad and good days. (maybe not Cas, he's as negative as it gets :) <-- JOKE)

[Omega]

There is such a thing as a realist. All being a realist means is that you truly try to base your decisions on knowledge and logic, not hope (optimist) or fear (pessimist).


No, there is no such thing as a realist. Everybody talks about 'this isn't real life' or that is 'real life'. Guess what, nobody is high enough on the totem pole, whether you are talking about religion, or science, or sociology, or politics, or psychology, to know exactly what they can accomplish--unless they do it. Very few people have enough varied and diverse experiences in different parts of the country, speaking different languages, living in different countries, going through different conditions, etc, to be aware of what 'real life' is. It just can't be done. Anybody who calls themself a realist a negative individual. Then again, maybe people who don't see things in a positive way really do know themselves very well and know they cannot achieve anything? So, to them, that is 'real'? While others know that they can achieve a lot, and to them, that is their 'reality' is to be positive and successful. Maybe our personalities just simply dictate where we end up.

Some say that our personalities are decided by age 3. So, this is my hypothesis: maybe some people know they are going to be successful when they are still young, while other people probably know, when they are still young, that they will not be successful. The people who know they are going to be successful, are reading the forums and seeking information and are generally very bright. On the other hand, the people who might know they won't be successful way back from their youth, are not the ones buying the motivational tapes, etc. It is the positive people who already know they will be successful that buy the motivational tapes for some guidance, not the negative people. In other words, the people who have always had their mind on success since they were very young are the ones likely to seek such information, which is why the motivational tapes, books, etc., might work on them. On the other hand, people with other personalities might feel that nothing good is going to happen, etc, and the reason they visit forums is because it's their hobby and they want somebody with a related interest to b*tch about life with, not to actually accomplish something.

I can't really think for the pessimist side because I am an optimist, and of course, everything I touch turns to gold (I wish), but for the pessimists--What do you think of this idea?

[KNau]

It is the positive people who already know they will be successful that buy the motivational tapes for some guidance, not the negative people.
Well, setting aside that there is no evidence supporting the above, it still doesn't negate the fact that less than 1% of those who buy Tony Robbins, 7 Habits, Purpose Driven, yadda yadda will actually achieve the results they are so positive will occur.

I actually consider the motivational tape habit as a sign of mental weakness since the act of buying them is an admission that one hasn't taken the time to fully develop as a responsible, accountable adult. What else could you consider a philosophy built upon the idea that there are "cheat codes" to life - that if you tape some affirmations to your bathroom mirror and repeat them to yourself then the world will conform to your desires. Reality is not maleable to your whims - but self-delusion may make it appear so.

I swear, only in the softy industrialized nations could cancers like this take hold. I doubt those that arrived in America with nothing but the clothes on their backs yet went on to build entire industries had to "censor their inner-critics". They just did what they had to do to succeed. At the risk of sounding sexist, it's called being a man!

Yes, we "negatives" bitch and moan but the fact is we still show up every day to get the job done because that (and not positive attitude) in the long run is what seperates winners from losers.

[Jay_Kyburz]

I swear, only in the softy industrialized nations could cancers like this take hold.

Are you serious. 90% of religion is about being a "better" person. At least the people are buying these books and tapes are being pro active and taking a vaguely scientific approach to it. (ie research).

Their aren't to many people that aren't interested in some form of self improvement.

I like the old glass half empty / full thing. It doesn't have anything to do with how many hours of news you watch, simply your perception of the world around you. Life is just easier when you can turn negative stuff around. i find.

[Vorax]

No, there is no such thing as a realist. Everybody talks about 'this isn't real life' or that is 'real life'. Guess what, nobody is high enough on the totem pole, whether you are talking about religion, or science, or sociology, or politics, or psychology, to know exactly what they can accomplish--unless they do it. Very few people have enough varied and diverse experiences in different parts of the country, speaking different languages, living in different countries, going through different conditions, etc, to be aware of what 'real life' is. It just can't be done. Anybody who calls themself a realist a negative individual. Then again, maybe people who don't see things in a positive way really do know themselves very well and know they cannot achieve anything? So, to them, that is 'real'? While others know that they can achieve a lot, and to them, that is their 'reality' is to be positive and successful. Maybe our personalities just simply dictate where we end up.

I disagree, the world is not so black and white. You don't need to be all knowledgable to be a realist, you only need enough information to make a decision. That doesn't mean the decision is correct and based on the reality of the universe, it is based on the reality and knowledge of the individual. Of course realists are fallable. Like a computer, a realist crunches the data and comes to a result without emotion, as much as possible, but like everyone they have negative tendencies and positive tendencies.

The incredible thing about the human mind is our ability to assimilate information, digest it and analyse it. However, when there is insufficient data, three types of personalities emerge (at least): Negative, positive and realist (neutral). The negative person sees the data in a negative light, the positive person sees it positively, the realist conceeds there is insufficient data. Fear, faith and logic.

The negative person may give up despite not knowing, the positive person may push forward despite having insufficient data and the realist will seek more data before making a decision.

Negative people are prone to not try, positive people are prone to waste time trying things that aren't feasible, realists are prone to indecision.

Call me negative if you like, but I believe you are making an assumption with insufficient information...as a postive thinker would :)

[Black Hydra]

Funny. Because it seems that there is mostly arguement about what a positive person is...

Some people here seem to think that positive people don't think anything will ever go wrong and they are deluded.

Positive attitude also has nothing to do with being a 'realistic person'. Yes some people are more apt when seeing pitfalls and risks. So called 'realists'. But this has nothing to do with positive or negative behaviors. The only reason I mentioned "realist" people above is because often times people DO confuse the two, or believe that, somehow, by being more negative, they are being more realistic...

You can be both a positive person AND a realist. In fact many people are. Vorax, you said that there were logical thinkers like yourself and that positive people relied on faith. I disagree. Positive thinkers, aswell as negative ones, can be logical. Positive thinkers don't think "everything will be okay, I don't have to work...". A positive thinker, instead, will work to perservere difficulties that a negative person might instead sit and whine about...

A positive attitude ALSO doens't mean that your running around smiling all the time. It doesn't mean you can't say negative things. Its a mindset that you use when viewing the world. Instead of thinking things like "If only the economy was better, I would have made more money" positive people can accept responsibility for there actions and turn negative happenings into a positive outlook.

The next thing I have to quarrel with is that so-called Self Help books are bad.

Someone pointed out that only 1% of people who read them achieve the positivity that the book was trying to give out.

Of course!

Personal change and personal growth are many, many time harder than buying or reading a book.

Thats like saying diet's don't work because most people don't keep off the weight. They don't keep off the weight because they fall back to there old habits. The people that DO stick with the diet lose the weight.

The comment about Self Help books being a sign of mental weakness offended me and showed me how ignorant the person who made the comment is. Yes, people need to take resposibility for there life, but often times the direction to personal growth is unclear. Books like "The Seven Habits..." may not work for everyone, or even most people, but they give the information that someone who wants to improve there life can use to fix it. Thats a bit like saying someone who wants to be an artist shouldn't read any books on art, because its a sign of weakness. If you don't need or want personal help books, that is fine, but to claim that someone who does benefit from them is defective in some way is a little much don't you think.

Unfortunately, with personal growth AND with diets, you are still required to bring the motivation and dedication to the table, which is why most people fail.

[KNau]

I'm really glad you brough up dieting because there is a strong correlation between the self-help and the diet industries, it's that both are just a hair shy of outright fraud.

The sole methodology of the diet industry be it Weight Watchers, Raw Foods or Atkins (especially Atkins!) is to take the smallest grain of truth and turn it into a life philosophy, adding layers of dogma to further dazzle the client / reader. They also drag out celebrity "success stories", failing to mention those individuals received personal counselling and incentive far beyond the standard. Hence every diet ad and motivational speaker ad carries the same disclaimer "Results Not Typical".

Dieters are set up to fail from the very beginning by being sold plans that are completely unsound. Blaming the client because they can't maintain a horrific high-protein lifestyle (and immediately put the weight back on thereafter) is finding fault at the wrong side of the equation.

There is only one formula to lose weight and maintain health - exercise + nutrition. Diet alone won't work, exercise alone won't work and this has been a proven fact for decades. Yet the trends continue because the common sense solution is the least appealing to desperate people. I think the same applies to the self-help market. I smell desperation in the air when someone buys "Chicken Soup for the Independent Game Developer".

The technique of goal achievment is basically ingrained in your core being through millenia of evolution - have a specific goal, have a plan on how to get there, have the flexibility to adjust that plan if needed, persevere. Don't you already know this?

Everything else from the affirmations to the sublimation of sexuality is hogwash and window dressing designed to hide the fact that the core philosophy is basic common sense. True, common sense may be the least common of all but then that goes back to my opinion on those who subscribe to such philosophies. Did you forget how to have a goal? Is that even possible to do?

[Promaginy]

Being diligent and being positive are two different things. Diligence is simply consistent effort - it can be good, evil, or neutral. Hitler was a diligent in his efforts to remake the world. Gandhi was also diligent. Yet they shared none of the same values about humanity.

To believe "if I just think positive, things will go well for me" is to ignore the importance of dilligence. Thinking is just one step in the process - there needs to be words, actions, habits, etc. I think that Swindoll's quote best sums up why attitude is important - it is the only thing we have 100% control over. Attitude and diligence are two sides of the same coin.

Quotable Quotes:

"When superior people hear of the Way, they carry it out with diligence. When middling people hear of the Way, it sometimes seems to be there, sometimes not. When lesser people hear of the Way, they ridicule it greatly. If they didn't laugh at it, it wouldn't be the Way."
~ Lao Tzu (c.604-531 B.C.)

"There is nothing which persevering effort and unceasing and diligent care can not accomplish."
~ Seneca (4 BC-65 AD)

The longer I live, the more I realize the impact of attitude on life. Attitude, to me, is more important than facts. It is more important than the past, than education, than money, than circumstances, than failures, than successes, than what other people think or say or do. It is more important than appearance, giftedness, or skill. It will make or break a company ... a church ... a home. The remarkable thing is we have a choice every day regarding the attitude we will embrace for that day. We cannot change the inevitable. The only thing we can do is play on the one string we have, and that is our attitude ... I am convinced that life is 10% what happens to me, and 90% how I react to it. And so it is with you ... we are in charge of our Attitudes."
~ Charles Swindoll

[Anthony Flack]

If the glass starts out empty and is filled to half-way, then it's half full.

If the glass starts out full and is drained to half-way, then it's half empty.

* From "Chicken Soup for the Independent Game Developer: Because That's What You'll Be Eating".

[Jay_Kyburz]

The longer I live, the more I realize the impact of attitude on life. Attitude, to me, is more important than facts. It is more important than the past, than education, than money, than circumstances, than failures, than successes, than what other people think or say or do. It is more important than appearance, giftedness, or skill. It will make or break a company ... a church ... a home. The remarkable thing is we have a choice every day regarding the attitude we will embrace for that day. We cannot change the inevitable. The only thing we can do is play on the one string we have, and that is our attitude ... I am convinced that life is 10% what happens to me, and 90% how I react to it. And so it is with you ... we are in charge of our Attitudes."
~ Charles Swindoll



Thanks Prom. These are great.

I'm not really a reader of self help books, but I'm prepared to admit that I don't know everything. My guess is that people that have thought about a problem enough to write a book will probably have _something_ to offer. Even if their is only one small thing in a book that appeals to you.

[Black Hydra]

Ugh. I think the real reason people are arguing about the benefits of POSITIVITY is because most people are arguing about what the word means. Seeing as the actual definition is irrelevant if you do not understand the true meaning when I referred it in the top post, I better explain what I mean. You may "define" positivity differently, but it really doesn't matter, positivity is just a word. And the way I describe it, I don't think you can argue its benefits.

Being a positive person means you take what obstacles life gives you and use them to motivate you to perservere. Example: Lets say Bob is completely broke. A positive person might see this as a challenge to gain more money. A negative person might see this as a failure of himself or outside influences and whine while he is poor.

Being a positive person, by my definition, has nothing to do with your logic to predict events, nor you ability to discern risks. A positive thinker isn't going to purchase the obviously stolen car from the chop-shop because he thinks "Everything will be okay".

Being a positive person ALSO has nothing to do with motivation and work ethic, although the bunch of them usually are found all in the same people. Being positive merely means that the set-backs and faults in life can be used to improve yourself. Without motivation or work ethic you won't get anything done, however, usually when you start thinking positively, motivation and ultimately learning better work ethic will follow in your positive-charged thoughts of improving your situation.

Positive thinking is different than being hopeful, or expecting a miracle. A positive thinker recognizes possible difficulties and seeks to make the best situation. I wouldn't consider the term of a positive attitude to directly relate to future events. A positive person may hope for the best, but this is completely unrelated to blind faith or deluded fantasies. Simply, a positive person will look at his current situation and seek to improve it, instead of whining. You can be just as logical when your a positive thinker, probably more so thinking negatively and wasting all that energy and time is hardly logical.

I think millionaire salesmen Zig Ziglar said it best: "I had to learn that they weren't rejecting ME, they were rejecting my offer." See, thinking positively he could realize that his lack of sales simply required more perserverance and skill. However, before when he thought negatively, he thought that he was just a failure.

Whatever YOUR definition of positive thinking is, this one is mine. It is the one I use to refer to in my above posts. You can define the word 'positive' any way you like but you have to agree of how powerful it is when I describe it this way.

No. Self-help books will not work for everyone. I personally don't read self-help books, but I have read a lot of free articles that could be listed under 'self-help' so I can see their value.

Yes most diets fail. This is because, in order to succeed at a diet you need to (1) Eat less. (2) Exercise. If they make a diet that never requires either of those it would be a huge success. Diet industries aren't fraudulent, its the fact that eating less and continuing exercising regiments require FAR more work than reading about the diet. While I often scoff at the advertisements for diets seeing as they always portray the best possible results (as do self-help books), most of them do give you tools you can use to increase the success rate if you hadn't read them at all. The same goes for self-help. It won't do work for you. That's the whole idea of "self"-help. But it can give you tools to help deal with procrastination, motivation, attitude, ect.

Its like buying a tool. If you expected a house to be built when you buy a table-saw, everyone would laugh at you. You still have to BUILD those things. Maybe its there aggressive advertising, but it seems that most people figure that your house will be built for you when you purchase self-help or diet books.

Part of the distrust of these books is that unless you have the motivation and energy to use the information its 100% useless. Seeing as that represents most people (at least without more forward motivation) most people fail. The fact that these people fail doesn't make the product fraudulent, it simply means that in order to purchase success, money, happiness, (or weight loss) you have to sacrifice ALOT more than a few bucks for a book.

[Promaginy]

Personally, I think that Black Hydra and KNau have agreement in principle, but the semanitcs are getting in the way.

The diet example is an excellent way of demonstrating why most people fail to acheive their goals. They try short-cuts and refuse to do the real work necessary for results (ie no dilligence). Everyone wants a magic pill.

What amazes me is that since time began, mankind has had religions and saints telling us on how to live a happy life. None of this stuff is hidden or even complicated, yet most people do not put this stuff into practice. People say that they want to live a happy life yet do everything opposite of what they should be doing! What irony! What humor!

[KNau]

Promaginy you're probably right about the semantics of the argument.

How do you make a video game? Well...you make one. You either do or don't. I think the positivity comes in the "doing" and persistence of a goal not in the "thinking happy thoughts" about it.

I'm wary about the positivity police because there's an emotional maturity that should be reached before employing information like neuro-linquistic programming, neuro-associative conditioning, etc. A classic example is an unnamed blogger (who's probably ignoring me anyways) who's stated goal is "self-actualization and picking up chicks" and blogs about how those around him are total losers, ruining his chances with said chicks. That demonstrates a shocking lack of maturity.

That and even Steve Pavlina's rantings of late are ringing too close to Christian Slater's character from Very Bad Things who uses his proactive, catch-phrase riddled goalsetting to justify all sorts of nasty behaviors. That mental training has essentially created a sociopath.

[Escotia]

That and even Steve Pavlina's rantings of late are ringing too close to Christian Slater's character from Very Bad Things who uses his proactive, catch-phrase riddled goalsetting to justify all sorts of nasty behaviors. That mental training has essentially created a sociopath.

Reading this certainly made me smile. I'm sure most of us that have worked in the mainstream industry can relate to having a boss just like this.

[BarrySlisk]

KNau: You remind me of me. I like you :D

[Black Hydra]

I don't want to be irritating person going around telling people to be cheery. Because everyone knows that doing that would just piss people off, thus doing the exact opposite of the intentions.

Hard work and dilligence are the key to success at anything. However, negative attitudes often lead to wasted energy spent on whining, where as a positive attitude can utilize your energy more efficiently.

A positive attitude also reflects outward from yourself. This is very important when your trying to convince people to buy your product. If you don't have 100% confidence in your product and yourself, who will?

I know confidence and positivity aren't directly related, but if you follow my last post, you can see that a positive minded person doesn't see lifes little bumps as personal failures but just as little offsets. Therefore it is extremely hard to have any confidence when you have a negative attitude, which by my past definition, involves an attitude of giving up, whining, and feeling that lifes little bumps are personal failures.

As everyone here has probably realized, personal traits such as dedication, determination, motivation, goal-setting and the likes usually co-mingle. So while finishing your game will be a direct result of motivation and dedication, those two factors are improved by goal setting, positivity, ect.

You will feel alot more energized and motivated once you start feeling good about yourself and your position. Because as long as you aren't dead, you still have the power to fight for what you want in life. And because none of use are dead, we can all feel really good that, despite minor problems or offsets, we always have the power to do what we want, and to get what we want.

I suppose that attitude is the key to my topic. Most of you, and certainly most successful people here, already have this attitude, even if you disagree with my wording or distrust so called self-help gurus.

[Promaginy]

I'm wary about the positivity police because there's an emotional maturity that should be reached before employing information like neuro-linquistic programming, neuro-associative conditioning, etc. A classic example is an unnamed blogger (who's probably ignoring me anyways) who's stated goal is "self-actualization and picking up chicks" and blogs about how those around him are total losers, ruining his chances with said chicks. That demonstrates a shocking lack of maturity.

No doubt! Self-actualization is not always a good thing if it entails stroking one's ego so much that it loses all track of reality.

I think it really comes down to basic values/philosophy about life. You can be a positive & diligent person but still lie, cheat, and harm others around you. Look at Hitler - he was a loyal husband, attended church regularly, and was a father image to the German people. His horrendous legacy is because he was so positive in his self-actualization and diligent in his efforts to remake the world in his image.

[oddvark]

Well, back to the original post, i got a 12 out of 13. The only one I "passes" was

10) I get angry at my spouse and don't talk for more than 4 hours.

because I'm not married, however if I was, I probably wouldn't talk to her for 8 hours.

[oddvark]

About the motivational books: Someone needs to write "8 habbits of Successfull Angry Individuals" for the rest of us. I have a feeling that just like liberal vs conservative there is simply a built in personality feature: cranky vs positive. I think both types can be successful, the only difference is in the motivation...the driving force behind the effort.

A few such habbits might be:

1. Beat the basturd who's better then you in EVERYTHING.
2. Listen to all the negitive thoughts in your head. Use them to build up angry energy to drive you.
3. Focus all your Anger on something productive.
4. When people compliment you, they are just lying! Get back at them for it.
5. When the Anger is too great, release some of it on your friends.

Of course, I'm just joking. Although its hard to tell because of my angry disposition.

[serg3d]

We, negative persons are perfectly OK. We are ready. It is a positive person who should worry.