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View Full Version : Help these girls on their last leg.



Musenik
03-20-2008, 07:13 PM
The game is almost finished. Not that there isn't plenty of work to do. Please help me generate a last list of tasks to make it worth shipping. I would greatly appreciate your feedback. This game is rated TEEN, for suggestive sexual content. (the demo, however, has almost none)

Screenshot:
http://p4.hostingprod.com/@mousechief.com/ssFirstGirl.jpg


PC demo download:
http://p4.hostingprod.com/@mousechief.com/DHSGirlsDemoSetup.exe

Mac demo download:
http://p4.hostingprod.com/@mousechief.com/DHSGirlsDemo.zip


I've spent two years developing this game. That is a bad gamble for the casual market. Now there are signs that story games are taking hold. I'm optimistic. Two years ago, I was thinking it would be more like a boardgame and simpler than the open world epic sandbox it's become. It wasn't suppose to take more than nine months. I hope I haven't bored the forum with my regular requests for feedback. However, in this demo, you'll find a brand new fibbing game and a revamped flirting game. I'm especially interested in hearing about their quality.

thank you all again,

Backov
03-20-2008, 08:46 PM
It's quite charming. :)

There's only two things that I found annoying.

First, the fib game sucks. The other games are quite neat, although I think the taunt game could use more variety and perhaps more feedback on how "powerful" the taunts are.

Second - there needs to be a better way to get an awareness of the board. It's zoomed in too close and it's hard to find the little pieces to click on sometimes.

Musenik
03-21-2008, 11:19 AM
I've attempted to improve the fibbing game. There is a new build on the website. Let's hope this one 'sucks' less.

Backov
03-21-2008, 11:28 AM
I just tried the new build (from your link in the first post, I assume?) and got an error. I uninstalled the previous build before installing this one.

Error is:

"The specified module could not be found. LoadLibrary(pythondll) failed."

Typo in python.dll?

Musenik
03-21-2008, 12:13 PM
Thanks Backov,

I'll have to look into it tonight. For now, I've reverted the pc build on the website back one version. I assume you're talking about the PC version...

papillon
03-21-2008, 01:21 PM
Haven't played this in a while... Time for a series of running notes!

Taunt behaves slightly strangely, the first taunt fired doesn't seem to get a response? Or am I misunderstanding it? It seems confusing.

I won a girl to my team easily, but then I'm not sure what the two girls' stats are and don't know how to choose which one to use for the next challenge. Clicking on the other girl seems to get me to an item-trading screen rather than info..

Fib game (I downloaded last night) is too confusing for my taste... the mechanics seem over-complicated and make it hard to grasp the underlying concept.

Once I get to Secretary Primly, the girls stats are showing below the action-options. But they weren't earlier.

Backov
03-21-2008, 01:32 PM
I just want to say, more of you gawkers should try this game. It's quite well done and I think it will do well once the last little issues are ironed out.

Musenik
03-21-2008, 01:48 PM
Thanks Papillon, for your notes.


Once I get to Secretary Primly, the girls stats are showing below the action-options. But they weren't earlier.

That was a conscious decision to hide the girl stats until after the initial tutorial. Same is true for location descriptions.

You're suppose to get your first gang of girls easily. Again, they're part of the initial tutorial section. You'll work for replacements later.

I'll try and get the refurb'ed fibbing game in a working build tonight.

There is also information in the inventory screen about the girl you clicked. Her four stats are listed beneath her.

MiceHead
03-21-2008, 05:08 PM
I always liked this game. Looking forward to seeing the finished version.

ChrisP
03-21-2008, 06:00 PM
Typo in the screenshot: "fiercly" should be "fiercely" in Lucille's description. The description also reads a little awkwardly... is there a missing word?

Musenik
03-21-2008, 06:45 PM
It's an old screenshot. It's been fixed. Thanks for reminding me. I'll have to shoot a new one.

So, I looked into the PC crash. I couldn't reproduce it. I made a fresh build and uploaded it. I'm hoping it was a transfer glitch. Could someone try it again?

AlexWeldon
03-22-2008, 11:35 AM
The game's fun. I agree with those saying that the fib minigame needs to be reworked. It isn't as much fun as the others, and the interface is confusing. "Flirt" also isn't that great. "Reveal" is my favourite of the challenges because it requires the most thinking.

There's something a little bit creepy about the sexual references, given that these are high school girls. If I had a 16-year-old daughter, I wouldn't want her saying things like "I've lost my cigarette lighter so I might have to ask a boy for a match. Who knows what he'd make me do for it?" I suppose it's realistic, since that's about the age at which girls start learning to use sex - or the suggestion of sex - to get what they want, but I'm not sure it's really the best message for a computer game. It depends on who you expect to be playing the game, though...

Musenik
03-22-2008, 12:02 PM
If I had a 16-year-old daughter, I wouldn't want her saying things like "I've lost my cigarette lighter so I might have to ask a boy for a match. Who knows what he'd make me do for it?"

The interesting thing about that text is, it's a lie the girls tell to the school secretary in order to shock him into giving them a hall pass. So, technically, they're using the fear of sex, not sex itself to get what they want.

I worked very hard to incorporate telling commentary on society, without preaching. I'm not sure how many players will 'get' the depth of storytelling going on here. Most gamer's aren't experienced with narrative sophistication. Just another fine attribute we indies can add to our games.

Oh, and Alex, I did mention in the start of this thread, I rated this game for TEEN audiences and older. I'm glad you enjoyed the game otherwise!

AlexWeldon
03-22-2008, 03:43 PM
The interesting thing about that text is, it's a lie the girls tell to the school secretary in order to shock him into giving them a hall pass. So, technically, they're using the fear of sex, not sex itself to get what they want.

I worked very hard to incorporate telling commentary on society, without preaching. I'm not sure how many players will 'get' the depth of storytelling going on here. Most gamer's aren't experienced with narrative sophistication. Just another fine attribute we indies can add to our games.

Oh, and Alex, I did mention in the start of this thread, I rated this game for TEEN audiences and older. I'm glad you enjoyed the game otherwise!

I appreciate social commentary, and it didn't go over my head. I think this is actually the first time I've felt a little uneasy about a game's content. Ordinarily I'd be the last person to complain about sexual content...

As I said, I think it's the combination of the age of the girls and me trying to imagine who's actually going to be playing the game.

A rating of teen doesn't necessarily imply that teens are the target market, but here the theme of the game does seem to suggest that some teenage girls might play it... and I'm not sure most of them have the maturity to get the same message out of the game that you think you're communicating.

Meanwhile, I can also picture a certain type of adult male finding it a bit titillating to play as a teenage girl, hiking up her skirt and flirting with everything in sight, which is also a little creepy.

Anyway, I'm not opposed to the game myself. I just think that a lot of people may take it the wrong way.

Fastestmanintheworld
03-22-2008, 05:01 PM
Really great production quality art-wise, the visuals and sound set a very effective tone and 'feel' for the game. Music is wonderful - didn't notice the composer(s) in the credits, or is this PD/CC stuff possibly?

Duncan

banshee
03-22-2008, 05:09 PM
AlexWeldon, I generally agree with you that the game is giving somewhat creepy messages, but I do not quite get this part:

If I had a 16-year-old daughter, I wouldn't want her saying things like "I've lost my cigarette lighter so I might have to ask a boy for a match. Who knows what he'd make me do for it?" I suppose it's realistic, since that's about the age at which girls start learning to use sex - or the suggestion of sex - to get what they want
I beg your pardon, it sounds like all 16 year old girls are just prostitutes in training. I've always thought that it is ABNORMAL, quite an exception, to use sex - or the suggestion of sex - to achieve other goals, and in your post it is presented as a universal law. As if learning "to use sex to get what they want" is a natural stage in the personal development of girls.

Musenik
03-22-2008, 07:41 PM
Duncan,

The music is from recordings that are out of copyright and from the 1920s or slightly earlier. We left in the pops and hisses, as long as they weren't too bad.

Backov
03-22-2008, 08:04 PM
Grabbed the installer from the link in the OP - uninstalled previous version, installed new version, same error.

AlexWeldon
03-23-2008, 01:14 PM
I beg your pardon, it sounds like all 16 year old girls are just prostitutes in training. I've always thought that it is ABNORMAL, quite an exception, to use sex - or the suggestion of sex - to achieve other goals, and in your post it is presented as a universal law. As if learning "to use sex to get what they want" is a natural stage in the personal development of girls.

You're putting a lot of words in my mouth there. The key phrase in my original post is "or the suggestion of sex," by which I include flirting, wearing sexy clothes, etc. I didn't mean to imply that it's normal for teenage girls to sleep with guys to get what they want, but a woman would have to be pretty clueless to reach adulthood without figuring out the sort of power she has over men when they're turned on by her.

I asked my girlfriend, who is a sexologist, if she considers it a normal stage in a girl's development to come to this realization and to put it to use at least once in a while. She said it definitely is, especially in this day and age where the media has started sexualising women at progressively younger ages. For instance: http://www.bratz.com.

Spore Man
03-23-2008, 10:07 PM
It's not just the media. Parents are letting 13 year olds leave the house in tops that show cleavage. Maybe I'm just old fashioned, or maybe too many idiots on this planet default to permissive parenting.

Fastestmanintheworld
03-24-2008, 04:40 AM
Duncan,

The music is from recordings that are out of copyright and from the 1920s or slightly earlier. We left in the pops and hisses, as long as they weren't too bad.

Sure, I'd assumed that - it's just that the music is so good, I think it would be great to make a list of the songs/pieces/composers. A little bit of free 'interest' value to your game, plus it's good karma.

Either way, great music choice - really love it. Good luck with the project.

Duncan

TentMap
03-24-2008, 07:10 AM
Good luck with the game, great to see it's close to release, I enjoyed trying your earlier builds.

I had a few issues with the current build, the "f" in the word "for" in the description of Lucille is clipped for me.

I went to Gladys in the Auditorium first, the first taunt seemed ok, but for the second one her taunt appeared behind the brown background, I could see a bit of it peeking out over the board. I have screenshots of the issues if you want them. EDIT: Nevermind that one, it was probably the thing she said at first, partially covered.

Also, when I alt tab in and out, the game moves to the right. I have my taskbar vertically on the left of the screen. The first alt-tab moves the game to the right of my taskbar, with the right hand side of the game sticking out on my second monitor, and the second alt-tab moves it further right.

Musenik
03-24-2008, 07:46 AM
Say Duncan,

You make a good point, and I have room on the music volume screen. It'll even make it look classy with all the 'so-and-so's band' names. I hope I can find all the original authors/bands...

Thanks for the glitches TentMap. The one bug is just what you said, her original text, not a taunt.

Pyabo
03-24-2008, 09:55 PM
The game has a mini-review in the latest issue of Wired! Nice exposure, Keith!

Cartman
03-25-2008, 09:55 AM
Way to go Keith. It's good to see that game getting finished. I'm working hard to have mine finished in the next month as well.

Musenik
03-25-2008, 11:01 AM
Thanks Keith,

Good luck with yours!

Just uploaded some fixes to the demo that remove a crash bug. Thanks for the feedback so far!

Ran to a bookstore and found the Wired article. It's more like a blurb, but it's positive and fairly visible in the top left of the page. Whoo hoo! Am I a success yet???

jomanto
03-26-2008, 06:17 AM
First of all: a really nice game!

I didn't have much time to play (will continue playing within the next days ;)) but I have a few (simple) suggestions to improve the user experience:

I downloaded and tested the Windows Demo.

1.) I know it's a rare environment, but when changing from fullscreen to windowed mode on my multi-monitor system (perhaps even with one monitor) all my opened windows are disordered and partly moved onto the secondary monitor.

2.) The I(nfo) buttons on the different screens are awesome regarding usability aspects, but I personally prefer to see an "Options" button somewhere in the main menu. A hint text would also do it (e.g. when moving the mouse over the button).

In the end these points are a matter of taste but can affect the first impression when starting the game.

Nevertheless, I'm a potential customer! :)

Backov
03-26-2008, 06:07 PM
I tried the version I downloaded the other day after getting it to work on Vista.

The Fib game as far as I can tell the only difference is the "con zone" indicator thingy. It makes it a little clearer, but it's still not a good minigame I'm afraid.

On the plus side, it didn't screw up my second monitor this time like the previous builds did.

RinkuHero
03-29-2008, 07:52 PM
Most gamer's aren't experienced with narrative sophistication.

It's funny that there's a typo in that sentence (it should be "gamers").

Anyway, I played an earlier version of this on TIGSource like a year or so ago and gave you my feedback then, I can't really add much to that. I hope the game does well.