"Ideas behind computer games can be copied" in the UK

[samnova]

Just saw this one http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/03/23/computer_games_copyright_law/ and was rather surprised/shocked.

Starts out with:

General ideas and structures behind computer games and programs can be copied as long as the source code and graphics are not, the UK's Court of Appeal has ruled.

If I read and understand it correctly then it would mean I could take a Mario game, with the same elements of gameplay, change graphics and of course use my own code. Hell, maybe even level layout could be the same.. And it would be legal!! I just don't think it would be.... We probably all remember back on the time when Great Gianna Sisters sales got blocked after Nintendo won a ruling saying it was too similar to Mario...

Any thoughts on this?

[luggage]

It's been like that for a very long time. And quite rightly. Someone should not have copyright over "a game where you jump on platforms" or "a game where you run around shooting things".

[JoKa]

Hell, maybe even level layout could be the same..
I'd be careful in this point. May not be a problem for something simple like a match3-playfield, but complex level structures could be interpreted differently.

[electronicStar]

If I read and understand it correctly then it would mean I could take a Mario game, with the same elements of gameplay, change graphics and of course use my own code. Hell, maybe even level layout could be the same.. And it would be legal!!
LOL where have you been the last 20 years?

And if that thing wasn't legal then most videogames ever released would be guilty according to this law.

[LilGames]

Even the Wheel was not a completely new invention. It was an innovation inspired from using rolling logs to move things. The log became an axel, and a slice from a bigger log became the wheel.

Everything gets inspired and built upon previous ideas...

[KNau]

On the level design there is a chance that something like that could fall under copyright rules. Even if they looked different, putting platforms and enemies in the exact same locations would be questionable.

In the end it doesn't matter whether it's legal or not. What matters is who has the most money to throw around meaningless litigation. Even if your game is completely legit any major publisher can shut you down with a lawsuit and a letter to your ISP.

[cliffski]

In the end it doesn't matter whether it's legal or not. What matters is who has the most money to throw around meaningless litigation. Even if your game is completely legit any major publisher can shut you down with a lawsuit and a letter to your ISP.

As someone who is currently experiencing precisely this, despite working on a totally original game. I could not agree more.
Grrrrrrr.

[lennard]

Rockstar running into problems - thought it looked like a good direction for you to go in.

[sillytuna]

General ideas and structures are not the same as copying levels, so no you couldn't do that.

No news here ;)

[svero]

As someone who is currently experiencing precisely this, despite working on a totally original game. I could not agree more.
Grrrrrrr.

Hrmm.. A very intreaguing teaser statement... Can you fill us in on more details?

[cliffski]

not until their lawyers reply to me ;(

[JoKa]

Just guessing where it comes from, but your url and the game's name are pretty similar to the name/website of a big publisher. Even if it's not the problem I wouldn't have dared to get so close to an other company.

[cliffski]

There are only so many words in english. I find it bizarre that people think they can have ownership of common phrases.
At this rate, in 20 years time, new games will be called "ggftfgh tytgh" as it will be the only non-copyrighted and trademarked name left.

[janwinnicki]

In fact - it's difficult to judge what is 'original concept', what can be copyrighted or patented and what can not. As said before - jumping over platforms, or double clicks seems to be so common, that would be really strange to capture these ideas exclusive to anybody. But where the border lies? In my opinion, every case is different.

[Backov]

There are only so many words in english. I find it bizarre that people think they can have ownership of common phrases.
At this rate, in 20 years time, new games will be called "ggftfgh tytgh" as it will be the only non-copyrighted and trademarked name left.

Just out of curiosity, is your new game inspired by the Amiga game of the same name? I loved that game back in the day. Definitely going to have to check it out when it launches.

[electronicStar]

I see you have changed the name already. I'm not surprised about the cease and desist because I can remember at least 3 different games with this name, plus a game devellopment studio, plus many other companies and franchises with this name.

[cliffski]

I haven't changed anything.

[sillytuna]

Rockstar is going to be covered in the computer games world. If this is the name you are having a problem with, I'd step away now and find a new name. I'm not a lawyer, but I don't see that you'd have a case and you'd be taking a major risk trying to fight it, let alone all the stress.

Firstly Rockstar (IMHO) would be right to defend the name in this case, even though I know you aren't deliberately trying to profit off their trade name.

Secondly, Rockstar will be virtually required to defend the trademark for business reasons.

"ROCKSTAR" is (Community) trademarked using Nice classification 9, 16 and 28 in Europe. This includes computer games (28). Adjustment according to capitalization isn't a big enough differentiator. It's a published trademark in various territories I'd have thought, as well as being extremely well known anyway.

Trademarking shouldn't be about locking out names unfairly, it's to stop people trading on the name within the same sector. If you were doing "cookery" it would be different.

The law can be an ass still. Read up on "Pimp My Snack" / "Pimp This Snack".

Edit: Although I think you're in legally dubious territory here, if you want the name then one option is to go public about it in such a way that it isn't advantageous for Take 2 to pursue the matter for PR reasons. After all, they don't have a game called RockStar, do they?

[papillon]

Interestingly, there are already several other games and software products that hit that namespace.

[sillytuna]

Suggest people post "Rock Star" games they know of alongside publishers and dates, although I'm sure Cliffski has now done a full search.

If a game has been released in the last few years under that name commercially, it would be helpful. Games from too long ago won't be relevant to this trademark dispute, if that's what's going on.

Best of luck Cliffski - I know first hand what it's like when companies decide to play games like this, which is why I'd advise you avoid the stress with a slight name change. It's not pleasant ,although it's nice when you win, for a given definition of "win".

If you (or anyone else) wants to contact me off forum then I'll be any help I can.

[electronicStar]

I haven't changed anything.
Ah sorry, I thought I had seen a version of the web page where the name was in one word "rockspace" ,I thought the "rock star" and "rock-star" variations had been added after. My mistake.